Comments on: Having lower TSH levels when taking thyroxine not unsafe, says recent research http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/2010/03/19/having-lower-tsh-levels/ Thyroid Treatment Scandal and Hypothyroid Mistreatment Sat, 11 Feb 2012 01:30:23 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Melissa http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/2010/03/19/having-lower-tsh-levels/comment-page-1/#comment-86115 Melissa Wed, 20 Jul 2011 03:11:40 +0000 http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/?p=4970#comment-86115 I am having Cushings symptoms. Swollen "Moon" face, as well as water retention in my abdomen. My TSH is .06 and my T4 is slightly high, I have no free T3 test, but I have T3 uptake is 35. I am desperate for help. My dr. has reduced my Levothyroxine to 50 mcg. I was taking 100 when the blood was drawn for the results I have given. I have severe depression/anxiety and I can't take this anymore! PLEASE HELP. I can't afford an endo dr. I think I have high levels of cortisol. I look like a Cushings patient but 9 wks. ago I took for 2wks Dexomethasone. Since then the cushings symptoms won't go away. Please help. I am afraid the reduction of my T4 hormone will make me gain more weight. I have gained 25 lbs when on the steroids and it is still here. I had chest pains that have stopped now. probably from the anxiety or edema. It was severe. I looked five months pregnant. Can anyone help me??? Thank you so much! (From Janie: Join patients groups. They can definitely help: http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/talk-to-others ) I am having Cushings symptoms. Swollen “Moon” face, as well as water retention in my abdomen. My TSH is .06 and my T4 is slightly high, I have no free T3 test, but I have T3 uptake is 35. I am desperate for help. My dr. has reduced my Levothyroxine to 50 mcg. I was taking 100 when the blood was drawn for the results I have given. I have severe depression/anxiety and I can’t take this anymore! PLEASE HELP. I can’t afford an endo dr. I think I have high levels of cortisol. I look like a Cushings patient but 9 wks. ago I took for 2wks Dexomethasone. Since then the cushings symptoms won’t go away. Please help. I am afraid the reduction of my T4 hormone will make me gain more weight. I have gained 25 lbs when on the steroids and it is still here. I had chest pains that have stopped now. probably from the anxiety or edema. It was severe. I looked five months pregnant. Can anyone help me??? Thank you so much!

(From Janie: Join patients groups. They can definitely help: http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/talk-to-others )

]]> By: Jolie http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/2010/03/19/having-lower-tsh-levels/comment-page-1/#comment-50739 Jolie Thu, 25 Mar 2010 13:04:24 +0000 http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/?p=4970#comment-50739 I find it's best not to listen to British thyroid 'experts'. They seemingly don't have the first idea what they are talkng about! I find it’s best not to listen to British thyroid ‘experts’. They seemingly don’t have the first idea what they are talkng about!

]]> By: Dr. Swerdloff http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/2010/03/19/having-lower-tsh-levels/comment-page-1/#comment-50729 Dr. Swerdloff Thu, 25 Mar 2010 08:15:22 +0000 http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/?p=4970#comment-50729 USC did a study that found that the upper limit of TSH was way off and published it in the Journal of Endocrinology 2003 where they found that a TSH of >= to 2.4(not 4.5-5 as was previously thought) was already associated with thyroid disease of some sort either nodules or Hashimoto’s disease. So I would venture to hypothesize that the lower limit of the range is also incorrect by at least the same amount. It would be nice to see some research in that direction as well. Remember Dr. Thiery Hertoghe's great grandfather Dr. Eugene Hertoghe described hypothyroidism as a set of clinical signs and symptoms( including the "Hertoghe Sign of Low Thyroid the loss of the lateral 1/3 of the eyebrow") (not as a lab condition) that improved with administration of thyroid. It wasn't till many years later that labs determined that there were four thyroid hormones and that T4 was the most prevalent. The makers of Synthroid equated the most prevalent to most important, little did they know that T4 is similar to pro-insulin in its low activity and that if an individual doesn't have enough of the Thyroid Peroxidase Enzyme because of Hashimoto's disease they will not easily be able to cleave off the iodide and make active T3 which is more easily assimilated by the brain and the rest of the body and will ultimately exhibit symptoms of low thyroid. USC did a study that found that the upper limit of TSH was way off and published it in the Journal of Endocrinology 2003 where they found that a TSH of >= to 2.4(not 4.5-5 as was previously thought) was already associated with thyroid disease of some sort either nodules or Hashimoto’s disease. So I would venture to hypothesize that the lower limit of the range is also incorrect by at least the same amount. It would be nice to see some research in that direction as well. Remember Dr. Thiery Hertoghe’s great grandfather Dr. Eugene Hertoghe described hypothyroidism as a set of clinical signs and symptoms( including the “Hertoghe Sign of Low Thyroid the loss of the lateral 1/3 of the eyebrow”) (not as a lab condition) that improved with administration of thyroid. It wasn’t till many years later that labs determined that there were four thyroid hormones and that T4 was the most prevalent. The makers of Synthroid equated the most prevalent to most important, little did they know that T4 is similar to pro-insulin in its low activity and that if an individual doesn’t have enough of the Thyroid Peroxidase Enzyme because of Hashimoto’s disease they will not easily be able to cleave off the iodide and make active T3 which is more easily assimilated by the brain and the rest of the body and will ultimately exhibit symptoms of low thyroid.

]]> By: Theresa http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/2010/03/19/having-lower-tsh-levels/comment-page-1/#comment-50650 Theresa Tue, 23 Mar 2010 15:21:39 +0000 http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/?p=4970#comment-50650 I plan to print everything on this page to take to my doctor next visit. The replacement doctor I saw last time had never seen such a low TSH test result (0.04). I had a bone mineral density test last year, just before I turned 50, and the result was that my bones are 20 (thanks to desiccated thyroid and it's contained calcitonin)! I use milk products semi-regularly, and rarely supplement with calcium, so we know where the credit lies! The doctor ordered the test due to very low, out of normal range TSH (consistently in the range of 0.03 - 0.04), which always seems to freak him out. Sadly, I'm still cold, fat, and not very energetic, but I'm awaiting the results of a 4-point cortisol saliva test to determine my adrenal status. If the stress of living 20 years with hypothyroidism alone didn't stress my adrenals, then raising 3 teenagers and dealing with my husband's traumatic brain injury from a long fall onto a concrete floor 9 years ago certainly contributed. (He's fine, even more a workaholic than ever before!) I plan to print everything on this page to take to my doctor next visit. The replacement doctor I saw last time had never seen such a low TSH test result (0.04). I had a bone mineral density test last year, just before I turned 50, and the result was that my bones are 20 (thanks to desiccated thyroid and it’s contained calcitonin)! I use milk products semi-regularly, and rarely supplement with calcium, so we know where the credit lies! The doctor ordered the test due to very low, out of normal range TSH (consistently in the range of 0.03 – 0.04), which always seems to freak him out. Sadly, I’m still cold, fat, and not very energetic, but I’m awaiting the results of a 4-point cortisol saliva test to determine my adrenal status. If the stress of living 20 years with hypothyroidism alone didn’t stress my adrenals, then raising 3 teenagers and dealing with my husband’s traumatic brain injury from a long fall onto a concrete floor 9 years ago certainly contributed. (He’s fine, even more a workaholic than ever before!)

]]> By: Eva M. O'Keefe http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/2010/03/19/having-lower-tsh-levels/comment-page-1/#comment-50488 Eva M. O'Keefe Fri, 19 Mar 2010 23:55:19 +0000 http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/?p=4970#comment-50488 You have NO IDEA how much your website has helped me. I was literally dying on T4 only and having every symptom of adrenal fatigue. I switched to Naturethroid (which is what I had to begin with before the shortage) and I am taking isocort.. I am a human being again.. Thank you so much for your valuable research.. I am buying the book shortly... Thank you, Eva You have NO IDEA how much your website has helped me.
I was literally dying on T4 only and having every symptom of adrenal fatigue. I switched to Naturethroid (which is what I had to begin with before the shortage) and I am taking isocort.. I am a human being again..
Thank you so much for your valuable research..
I am buying the book shortly…
Thank you,
Eva

]]> By: Kara S http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/2010/03/19/having-lower-tsh-levels/comment-page-1/#comment-50485 Kara S Fri, 19 Mar 2010 22:55:13 +0000 http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/?p=4970#comment-50485 Hullo! Here's a comment with medical abstract urls that I'd written recently about suppressed TSH - which is how I function best. Luckily, I found a doc who supports me (and just to be sure, I'd printed out these abstracts and taken them to our first meeting). Hope it helps someone - enjoy! Kara ---- When I looked into what endos/etc actually said about the negative effects of a suppressed TSH, the only one I see mentioned is OSTEOPOROSIS. That's it, unless I'm missing something. (And if I am, please do correct me.) . However, many medical research papers detail groups of patients who were purposely medicated to suppress TSH due to thyroid cancer; The papers show that these patients exhibit NO OSTEOPOROSIS, as long as they have not exhibited physical hyperthyroid symptoms (arrythmia, tremors, etc). These patients were cancer patients, since TSH suppression is the common treatment for that; however, the same findings can be extended to non-cancer patients. . In other words, THE ONLY WORRY ABOUT A SUPPRESSED TSH IS OSTEOPOROSIS, AND THAT DOES NOT OCCUR WHEN THE PATIENT DOES NOT EXHIBIT HYPERTHYRIOD SYMPTOMS. . Other papers point out that the TSH test was developed from a bell curve of "normal" patients, and that any scientist will recognize that bell curves have legitimate outliers (people - like myself and many on these forums - whose perfectly good numbers happen to fit on the tails of the bell curve). In other words, as you already know, high and low TSH's can be perfectly normal for some people. . I had printed out these abstracts and other websites in order to take them to my doc so he would hopefully feel comfortable dosing Armour to my symptoms instead of my TSH. (And yes, he is currently doing so, and we are keeping an eye on my bone density, just to be sure.) With luck, they will be useful for others as well. . T4 Suppression / Osteoporosis - Randomized trial of pamidronate in patients with t... [J Clin Endocrinol Metab. 1998] - PubMed result http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9661603?dopt=Abstract . Lack of deleterious effect on bone mineral density... [Endocr Relat Cancer. 2005] - PubMed result http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16322336?dopt=Abstract . Treatment of benign nodular goitre with mildly sup... [J Intern Med. 2002] - PubMed result http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11982740?dopt=Abstract . Clinical value of a sensitive immunoradiometric as... [Ann Clin Biochem. 1985] - PubMed result http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/4062219?dopt=Abstract . California Center for Pituitary Disorders at UCSF - Pituitary 101 - Pituitary Disorders - Hypothyroidism http://ccpd.ucsf.edu/hypothyroidi.shtml . TSH and Patients' Experiences: Suppressed to 0.5 / Alt.Support.Thyroid Newsgroup Website http://www.altsupportthyroid.org/tsh/tshexp1pr.php . MyThyroid.com: Osteoporosis http://www.mythyroid.com/osteoporosis.html Hullo!

Here’s a comment with medical abstract urls that I’d written recently about suppressed TSH – which is how I function best. Luckily, I found a doc who supports me (and just to be sure, I’d printed out these abstracts and taken them to our first meeting).

Hope it helps someone – enjoy!
Kara

—-

When I looked into what endos/etc actually said about the negative effects of a suppressed TSH, the only one I see mentioned is OSTEOPOROSIS. That’s it, unless I’m missing something. (And if I am, please do correct me.)
.
However, many medical research papers detail groups of patients who were purposely medicated to suppress TSH due to thyroid cancer; The papers show that these patients exhibit NO OSTEOPOROSIS, as long as they have not exhibited physical hyperthyroid symptoms (arrythmia, tremors, etc). These patients were cancer patients, since TSH suppression is the common treatment for that; however, the same findings can be extended to non-cancer patients.
.
In other words, THE ONLY WORRY ABOUT A SUPPRESSED TSH IS OSTEOPOROSIS, AND THAT DOES NOT OCCUR WHEN THE PATIENT DOES NOT EXHIBIT HYPERTHYRIOD SYMPTOMS.
.
Other papers point out that the TSH test was developed from a bell curve of “normal” patients, and that any scientist will recognize that bell curves have legitimate outliers (people – like myself and many on these forums – whose perfectly good numbers happen to fit on the tails of the bell curve). In other words, as you already know, high and low TSH’s can be perfectly normal for some people.
.
I had printed out these abstracts and other websites in order to take them to my doc so he would hopefully feel comfortable dosing Armour to my symptoms instead of my TSH. (And yes, he is currently doing so, and we are keeping an eye on my bone density, just to be sure.) With luck, they will be useful for others as well.
.
T4 Suppression / Osteoporosis – Randomized trial of pamidronate in patients with t… [J Clin Endocrinol Metab. 1998] – PubMed result
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9661603?dopt=Abstract
.
Lack of deleterious effect on bone mineral density… [Endocr Relat Cancer. 2005] – PubMed result
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16322336?dopt=Abstract
.
Treatment of benign nodular goitre with mildly sup… [J Intern Med. 2002] – PubMed result
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11982740?dopt=Abstract
.
Clinical value of a sensitive immunoradiometric as… [Ann Clin Biochem. 1985] – PubMed result
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/4062219?dopt=Abstract
.
California Center for Pituitary Disorders at UCSF – Pituitary 101 – Pituitary Disorders – Hypothyroidism
http://ccpd.ucsf.edu/hypothyroidi.shtml
.
TSH and Patients’ Experiences: Suppressed to 0.5 / Alt.Support.Thyroid Newsgroup Website
http://www.altsupportthyroid.org/tsh/tshexp1pr.php
.
MyThyroid.com: Osteoporosis
http://www.mythyroid.com/osteoporosis.html

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