April 25, 2006
Hopefully, those of you who read this Blog have also read the page titled GIVE ME A BREAK, because I just added #37 of another HILARIOUSLY RIDICULOUS comment made by a medical-school-trained doctor!! hahahahaha. Though we can laugh, it’s also SO SAD!!!!!! No wonder we have had to figure things out for ourselves! GIVE ME A BREAK!
This entry was posted on Tuesday, April 25th, 2006 and is filed under Doctors. You can follow any responses to this entry through the RSS 2.0 feed. You can leave a response, or trackback from your own site.
Frank said:
Apr 27, 06 at 6:47 pmThanks for your time. I hope very much to hear a reply.
This website’s creators could be seriously hurting people. It is okay to advocate a treatment that has *demonstrated safety and efficacy*, but is it ethically right to do so without such evidence?
The evidence that you cite are personal stories. Although powerful, they are purely anecdotal. Cocaine or Heroine users could make identical claims about their respective habits, with respect to decreasing pain and improving mood. This is why we call for objective evidence to support our claims. The sad thing is that this website might pray on people who are losing or have already lost hope due to the pain of disease. Desperate, broken individuals are not difficult to convince.
Instead of instilling a false hope with an unproven product–regardless of whether it has or hasn’t helped the writers of this website–I think it would be wise to educate people on their options, and allow them to make a choice based on the available information. This website instead seems to bully individuals to a particular mindset by berating traditional standards of treatment anecdotally.
It may turn out to be true that current treatments for hypothyroidism are substandard, and you could help your community by attempting to prove that with concrete evidence before making these brash claims. I admire your dedication to those suffering from thyroid problems… redirecting this dedication, you could do tremendous things for those suffering from these diseases.
Thanks for your time,
Frank
Janie said:
Apr 27, 06 at 7:15 pm“Frank”, your first sentence states, ” This website’s creators could be seriously hurting people.” Let us explain to you what has “seriously” been “hurting people”: Doctors who put their patients on T4-only medications, then ignore those very patients when they complain of one hypo symptom after another. Doctors who, when the patients complain, put the patient on anti-depressants, statins and many other masking drugs of simply poorly treated hypo symptoms.
You then ask “…is it ethically right to do so without such evidence?” I return to you another question: Is is ethically right to put patients on a medication like Synthroid that doesn’t work in various degrees over and over and over? It is ethically right to REFUSE to put a patient on Armour when they request it, which MANY doctors do? Is it ethically right to put patients on MORE drugs that simply mask symptoms which are due to an inadequate treatment?
You than hilariously state: “Cocaine or Heroine users could make identical claims about their respective habits, with respect to decreasing pain and improving mood.” Funny, but Armour replaces what the sick thyroid fails to give the patient. I don’t recall the body making Cocaine and Heroin.
You next state: “The sad thing is that this website might pray on people who are losing or have already lost hope due to the pain of disease. Desperate, broken individuals are not difficult to convince.” No Frank, DOCTORS prey on desperate broken individuals by stating that in spite of the patients contined hypothyroid symptoms while on T4-only medications, they are “normal” and their problems couldn’t possibly be their thyroids. THIS site gives those patients hope that there IS a better medication which give them back exactly what their own thyroids don’t give them.
You also state: “Instead of instilling a false hope with an unproven product…” False hope? Unproved product?? Hmm, perhaps the THOUSANDS upon THOUSANDS of us who WERE desperate and suffering in the hands of ignorant, narrow-minded doctors…who then switched to Armour, and had their lives change 180 degrees…are all IMAGINING it all?? No, Frank. It’s not false hope. It’s REAL hope. And desiccated thyroid is a product that has been around FAR FAR longer than Synthroid or other T4 meds, and has PROVEN itself by the EXPERIENCES of THOUSANDS who have been on it, or ARE on it.
You also state: “you could help your community by attempting to prove that with concrete evidence before making these brash claims.” Dear Frank, our LIVES are the proof, and is what medical professionals in their high and mighty medical-school trained minds IGNORE. WE are the proof, Frank. And someday, we will hope to see the research that will prove what WE ALREADY KNOW, Frank. But ultimately, though it will be a nice asset to what we already know, our LIVES are the proof. Sorry, but you cannot discount real life experiences, and when doctors continue to do just that, and treat patients as if they can’t possibly know their bodies and what is NOT working, THEY are the ones doing a tremendous disservice to millions of thyroid patients.
Cindi Straughn said:
Apr 27, 06 at 7:24 pmI think one thing that Frank doesn’t realize is that there ARE thyroid doctors who say exactly what this website says. Frank, go to the Books list on this site and read some of those books. All this site has done is bring back the old knowledge that has been lost due to the influence of the T4 drug peddlers.
Chris Jackson said:
Apr 27, 06 at 7:34 pmI support everything Janie says, but I’ll add that I’ve not heard one person who was on Armour want to go back to synthroid, but there’s an huge wave of people who are suffering on T4 meds who are desperately trying to figure out how to get their doc to prescribe them Armour Thyroid or even get ahold of it on their own because they’ve been to several docs that wouldn’t precribe it.
If you read enough success stories, you will likely come to the same conclusion that we thyroid advocates have known for years, that Armour Thyroid works great, synthetic T4 is substandard treatment.
Chris
Kerry said:
Apr 27, 06 at 8:26 pm“This is why we call for objective evidence to support our claims.” This is a direct quote from Frank’s response.
Let’s talk about something that is measured objectively, how about a blood test for cholesterol? This is one of the way’s hypothyroidism was diagnosed before the TSH test came along. High cholesterol equaled hypo. Now, let’s talk about my cholesteral climbing from 199 to 207 to 217 during my three year treatment on Synthroid. My most recent cholesterol blood test after being on Armour for 10 months with no change in diet, exercise, no addition of supplements or other medications. The test came back at 162. This is not subjective, this is objective, lab test proven results.
Perry Ross said:
Apr 27, 06 at 10:06 pmBullfeathers. Armour has over 100 years of safety and efficacy. The doses spoken of here are the ones that were used by doctors until recently. Go to http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/references/ and read the 51 pages of references, then go to http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/books-on-thyroid/ and read the 15 books. That should hold you for a while, objective-evidence-wise.
Besides, if modern allopathic medicine has all of this “objective evidence” and treatments that have “demonstrated safety and efficacy”, why are there so many hopeless people for us to “pray” (sic) on? Indeed, prayer may be the only hope for those unfortunate thyroid patients who have fallen into the clutches of the cash-mad drug pushers that pass for medical professionals today.
During the century of successful Armour use, primitive unsophisticated doctors simply made their patients feel better and felt that they had done their jobs. Thank heavens modern medicine knows better. They know that what people need are statins and benzos and SSRI’s and proton pump inhibitors and beta blockers and cardiac bypass and Phosamax and Vioxx and Viagra.
You say it’s ok for us to “educate people on their options”, but in the same breath you criticize us for presenting such options. This is the kind of self-contradictory advice that, if followed, allows nothing but “ask your doctor if Armour is right for you”. But we already know what the doctors think — that’s why we’re desperately googling for something else that will actually work.
Valerie said:
Apr 28, 06 at 3:01 amYes, this website DOES prey on people that are totally in desperate conditions…people left that way by a medical profession that has failed them. When doctors start treating this disease properly, this website won’t be necessary and I am sure we will all cheer that day. In the meantime, maybe even a few people out there that are suffering on T4 only meds will be able to find their health agian. 25 years is a long time to give my trust to doctors and when FOUR specialists let me down and offered me antidepressants to fix my congestive heart failure… well I guess that wasn’t going to be much help. Sites like this saved my life.
Deborah said:
Apr 28, 06 at 4:08 amFrank, have you actually read this site? Doctors who believe that Armour comes from cows and horses? Who belittle people who are ill simply because they are incapable of simple CLINICAL diagnosis?
I can see signs of hypothyroid in so MANY people every day, yet they go undiagnosed or undertreated because the TSH says they’re not hypo. When the TSH (Thyroid Stimulating Hormone, produced by a healthy pituitary) is used as a way to determine the TYPE of hypothyroid that someone has rather than WHETHER they’re hypo at all, THEN I will respect the knowledge of the medical community. When they are able to make a clinical diagnosis based on signs and symptoms, rather than be totally dependent on little black marks on a piece of paper called “lab results,” then I will respect the knowledge of the medical community. When doctors also diagnose and treat adrenal insufficiency based on signs and symptoms (with the addition of APPROPRIATE lab results) and treat it BEFORE beginning treatment with ANY thyroid hormone source, then I will respect the knowledge of the medical community. When people are prescribed ENOUGH of the right thyroid medication that works with THEIR body, so that they are healthy and don’t need umpteen other meds to treat hypo symptoms, then I will respect the medical community.
And Frank? I think you meant that we “prey” on sick people, not that we “pray” on them. People may be prayed over or prayed for, but never prayed on–unless it is a child sitting on someone’s lap. I think I’ve made it clear that it is obvious to me that it is the medical community that preys on sick people, for profit and their own gain. It makes me sick.
Ancient Mariner said:
Apr 28, 06 at 6:54 amFrank,
Are you a thyroid patient? A doctor, maybe? I’m afraid you have this all wrong. This website offers people hope where previously there was none. The people who come to this website have been suffering, many for years, all the while being told by their doctors that their labs are normal, and that proves there’s nothing wrong with them.
This website offers an alternative to the diagnosis and subsequent “standard of care” for thyroid problems, and gives patients knowledge about ALL alternatives, not just those their doctors promote.
Diagnosis by symptoms has been replaced with diagnosis by labs. Proven treatments that were used for more than 100 years have been thrown out the window in favor of “new and improved”, synthetic treatments.
Because natural substances cannot be patented, and therefore cannot be profited from, the pharmaceutical industry has promoted their new, synthetic thyroid hormones by bad-mouthing the competition, reminiscent of political battles. They have publicized untruths about natural thyroid hormones, and covered up the fact that their products are less stable and less effective than natural products.
In the 40 years since Synthroid and the TSH test became popular, there have been new diseases created (fibromyalgia, high cholesterol, osteoporosis, chronic fatigue syndrome, to name a few) to describe the effects of undertreated thyroid issues. These new diseases also make it possible for the pharmaceutical industry to sell more new drugs than ever before. They even reward doctors who prescribe these drugs.
Read the recommended books. Check out the websites. Look at the studies done 100 years ago. Open your mind, Frank!
Missy said:
Apr 28, 06 at 7:40 amFrank, do you have evidence that your claims are true? That the advice here is dangerous? That people are actually dying or becoming very sick from this advice? Do you have evidence that someone has had a heart attack or died from taking Armour?
There appears to be evidence here that it is TRUE that people are recovering with dessicated thyroid hormones when T4 only meds did nothing for them. The evidence is in their stories and their changed lives! Listening to patients is what many doctors no longer do.. lab values are much more important to most of them. Maybe YOU are a doctor who barely listens to his patients and goes more by lab values?? A doctor is a service..we pay you. We will not pay a doctor who won’t help us. We will find another one who will and and I am finding more and more that this is a growing grassroots movement..our voices will be heard one way or another.
We as patients are crying out for doctors to LISTEN to us. We don’t want to be told yet again that we are eating too much, exercising too little and just getting old. When our brains are so fogged over from undertreated hypothyroidism that we no longer care anymore, don’t you think that there might be something wrong EVEN though the TSH is ‘normal’??
You say Armour is unproven? It has been in use for over 100 years!! How much more proof do you need that it has worked for people? I say the stability of Synthroid and other T4 only meds is much more in question than the stability of Armour! Look up the statistics and recalls..
This site is all about Natural Thyroid, not ‘other options’. If you want a site with options, why don’t you start one?
P.S. Heroine should be spelled Heroin and you use the word pray and should have used prey.
Missy
Cindi Straughn said:
Apr 28, 06 at 5:48 pmone more thing Frank might want to look into….was Synthroid ever proven to actually BE effective or superior to the desiccated thyroid extract that had been in use safely and effectively for decades? you know…an actual study about well-being and health and not just a making the lab number look good? and Frank might want to ask himself why a “synthetic” product was even made if something was working already? hmmm…could it have to do with not being able to make money off of a non-patented thyroid extract?
Renee said:
May 03, 06 at 6:33 amFrank, you didn’t read first. I love this site. Too bad I didn’t find it before I trusted ALL the doctors that missed my high TSH for years and all the symptoms that were in my head and wanted to treat me with anti-crap drugs. In the past 8 months I have seen 4 different doctors and 1 was a top Endo in in the Country. Not one would try T3 in any form. I now take Armour and it has SAVED me.
kristie said:
May 09, 06 at 10:26 amWe hypothryoid folks just want proper treatment to get back to our lives. I’m tired of being compared to cocaine or heroin users.
Docs throw anti-depressants at me with no blood test to prove I need them, but I can’t get enough thryoid meds because of the TSH test.
Elaine said:
May 23, 06 at 10:20 pmFrank,
Hmmmmmmmmmmm, you sound suspicious to me, you just might be a doc, just my intuition!
Anyways, anything that is synthetic, be it meds or food, we all should run away from it!
Dessicated thyroid is all we had decades ago and it worked, and yes, why the need for synthetic thyroid?
$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$
It is all about the bottom dollar baby!
I think that I have made my point!
Elaine
T.N. said:
May 28, 06 at 6:04 amHehehe…I think Frank wasn’t expecting such a huge amount of responses to his message *chuckles*
Aaaw…i so love you guys! really! *hugs you all!*
April Reed said:
Jun 20, 06 at 2:37 amHi,
Just wanted to add my 2 cents, you can bet your bottom dollar Frank is a doctor. I have been a nurse for 26 years and I can tell this man is loyal to the almighty drug companies.
I thank God I found this site, I was diagnosed 1 year ago as hypo and put on synthroid , along with zoloft, and high dose motrin for aches and pains. It is a racket as you have described to put $$$$$$$$$$$$ in the drug companies pockets.
I feel better and have regained my life since starting Armour.
The sad reality is- doctors are taking the older patients who have been on Armour for years, off of it and putting them on synthroid. They are told it is far superior to Armour and it makes me just want to scream NO IT ISN’t!!!!
Thanks again for a truely enlightening website.
April
april said:
May 09, 07 at 10:12 pmFrank I have a feeling you are a very frustrated doctor who feels threatened by us and by this website. If you are a doctor, and 10 years from now you want to STILL be a PRACTICING doctor here’s some advice: L-I-S-T-E-N to your patients!