The following insightful post was written by UK hypothyroid patient Sarah Wilson.
My daughter (25) has epilepsy. What’s that got to do with being hypothyroid and Natural Thyroid Hormones (NTH)? Quite a lot, by the look of things.
My daughter’s epilepsy is triggered by unstable blood sugars. And since taking Metformin (medication to improve blood sugar control), she has significantly reduced the number of seizures. Being a good hypothyroid Tiger-mother, I have been doing mega amounts of research and we got to the Metformin approach through reading hundreds of academic medical journals. What I found along the way got me thinking about NTH and Hypothyroidism.
I have a strong hunch, backed up by some meaty academic evidence, that when patients develop hypothyroid symptoms, they are actually becoming insulin resistant. There are many symptoms in common between women with PCOS and hypothyroidism–the hair loss, the weight gain, et al. http://insulinhub.
Guess what? This is exactly what happens to Diabetes patients when Metformin is introduced. http://en.
If you are technically minded then you might want to read these articles. http://www.
They are a bit tough-going on the science but worth ploughing through. Why? Note the following comments/partial statements: ”Hypothyroidism is characterized by decreased insulin responsiveness”; ”the pivotal regulatory role of T3 in major metabolic pathways”; ”The effect of thyroid hormone on basal metabolic rate was recognized more than a century ago”
The community knows that T3/NTH makes hypothyroid patients feel better – but the medical establishment is scared of T3/NTH – probably because they don’t understand how it really works. The medical establishment might find an alternative line of argument about impaired metabolism more palatable if we can show them this real proof that the old desiccated thryoid treatment **was/is** having the right result – the i.e. the T3 is jump-starting the metabolism by re-activating AMPK. If Metformin (or one of the other anti-diabetic meds) could actually also do the same thing for hypothyroidism without the “dangers” of NTH, they they should be jumping at the opportunity. The great news is that Metformin is very cheap, stable and has very few serious side effects (and certainly none on the heart). To use the car engine metaphor, if glucose is our petrol, AMPK is the spark plug and both T3 and Metformin are both ignition switches. Sometimes if you have flat batteries in the car, it doesn’t matter how much you turn the ignition switch or pump the petrol pedal, all it does is flatten the battery and flood the engine.Dr. Skinner in the UK has been treating “pre-hypothyroidism” the way that some doctors treat “pre-diabetes”. Those hypothyroid patients who get treated early (before the wretched blood numbers get into the magical range) probably haven’t had their AMPK pathways altered and the T4-T3 conversion still works. The use of drugs as prophylactics is well understood by the medical establishment (e.g. baby aspirin for hearts), so there is no reason therefore why thyroid hormone replacement therapy shouldn’t logically be given to ward off a greater problem down the line.
It’s my belief that there is clear and abundant academic evidence that the AMPK/Metformin research should branch out to also look at thyroid disease.
As a supplementary on the history. I have PCOS; my female relatives have PCOS; my mother has just developed breast cancer which we are certain is related to the oestrogen dominance/insulin resistance. My daughter also has had Coeliac Disease since weaning (and oh boy, that was a fight to get a diagnosis but we got there). My daughter was showing lots of PCOS symptoms (some of which are of course hypothyroid symptoms) alongside the Estrogen, but because there were no cysts…no diagnosis, which is not correct by the Amsterdam criteria, but there we have it. So we moved “off topic” in PCOS terms, did a 9 month experiment of adding and subtracting one thing at a time to get to a (more) stable outcome. We never got the PCOS diagnosis but we did end up with T2DM Type 2 Diabetes) by the backdoor and the Metformin. We had two stupid consultants who reduced her to tears – their logic was unbelievably crass and at odds with long standing proof: “there isn’t a tap in your neck which stops the sugar getting to your brain you know” grrrrr. I have since found the links between people with T1DM (Type 1 Diabetes) who inject insulin and hypothyroidism too.
So my idea is that we need to talk to the medical profession in a language they relate to. They think Natural Desiccated Thyroid is voodoo, so they switch off. YET the NDT is doing something very, very scientific: the direct T3 is kicking the closed -own metabolic process back into life, just like Metformin does for insulin resistance. Who says there isn’t more widespread T4 resistance? http://www.
http://www.hotthyroidology.
Disclaimer: I am not medically trained and I haven’t even got a University degree. My business, however, is researching complex financial data and since leaving school, I have probably graduated with a PhD in the University of Life. My daughter has two degrees and my husband is in IT so I’ve learned a lot about logic over the past 30 years. I think that to take this debate forward, we need someone with the credibility to do a piece of academic research and get it put into one of the highly ranked journals – even doing a relatively straightforward meta-analysis of all the published works on AMPK/T3 /metabolism would be a start. I know everyone feels desperately miserable about not being treated properly, and it is probably very sexist that us bunch of moaning women are not taken seriously. BUT perception is reality and we have to deal with that reality as best we can. And I think that our sisters in the chronic fatigue/ME camp should have reason to join us on our quest too. I wouldn’t know where to start to find out how to sponsor a university researcher but maybe we should think about that as our “big thing”.
Let’s talk. Reply to this blog post and I’ll comment back to you so others can learn from our conversation as well.
60 Responses to “Hypothyroidism, Insulin resistance and Metformin: read this brilliant information!”
Elizabeth Brault
This is a great article. Thanks for putting this all together – I’ll be researching it more, as I’ve been thinking a lot about blood sugar and hypoT lately, particularly in my case but also in regards to my 8 year old daughter.
Jane
Broda Barnes showed that hypoglycemia and by default, insulin resistance, is hypoT.
Rosemary
Great article pulling together different aspects of metabolic dysfunction usually looked at separately, but here Sarah Wilson urges us to look at the relationship between them. I think there is lots to think about here; Thanks Sarah for putting this together.
Ann Nederdal
Dear Sarah
Thank you so much for your post and research! This is good news!
I will support any action that will make progress for us all.
I like to follow your future investigation.
Please contact me if I can do some good.
Sincerely
Anna Nederdal. Sweden.
C. J.
Are there any clinical studies/patient research being done? I’m at that desperate stage, desperate to stop the weight gain (most is all around the middle, typical of insulin resistance).
Yes, I’ve tweaked my menu’s and educated myself as best I can, and I’m doing most everything right. I Know absolutely that I need something else, in addition to, what I’m doing now (and yes, I’m on Armour).
I’ve often thought of the similaries, diabetes and hypothyroidism, and the insulin resistance factor, but haven’t seen anything like the articles mentioned. Fantastic. I’m So ready to try the Metformin. I live in St Petersburg, FL area. Now I just need a doctor willing to experiment with me. I’ve now reached 100 lbs overweight, so hey, of course I’m ready to try something.
And thank you, Sarah Wilson. You’re awesome.
Avril Reed
Your article makes great sense.
What dosage 500 mg or 850 mg.for Metformin?
I used to be on armour but now take synthroid and cytomel for T4 and T3.. I exercise 4-5 times a week and eat no gluten.
I am trying to lose 25 lbs that I gained. I have already lost 6lbs but it is so slow….only a pound a month so I really need a kick start.
Metformin sounds like the right kickstart.
thanks
Avril
Fiona Kennard
THANK YOU ! My daughter had PCOS and now doesn’t have PCOS ( really according to our NHS) ! I have hashimoto’s and am trying to use T4 and T3; my son has always had sugar processing problems he’s now 28 (I first flagged this when he was 2). Shall be following through your valuable links.
Interestingly my son is much much better over the last few weeks taking a glass of salt water before he goes to work and a mulitvitamin – interesting!
Rhonda
Fiona…once you have PCOS you have PCOS…you may not have cyst and menstual cycles do sometimes get regular and then are absent again. “Specialist” also told me I no longer had PCOS after being diagnosed with it and on fertility pills to conceive a child. Went to this “Specialist” and because he didn’t see cyst on a sonogram I was cured! NOT! When it was time to try for a second child, I had to wait 6 months to start treatment because I had 3 cysts on one ovary and they had to wait for them to dissolve or fall off! I do know through my own family history that with PCOS you should also pay close attention to undiagnosed thyroid issues! My 21 year old was just diagnosed with Hashimotos one year ago and now PCOS 6 weeks ago. She has been on synthroid for a year and her levels are just where we started out. Synthroid is not working for her and we are switching to a doctor who will prescibe desiccated thyroid. She currently takes metformin for PCOS!
Deb in MI
Wow! That has been my experience as well, in that I was hypothyroid for so long, unknown. As I look through what old labs I do have, my fasting glucose has been off for a long time too.
So within 2 years of getting my hypothyroid state addressed, my fasting glucose goes above 100 which my new doc says should be watched and she gives me metformin which I can’t tolerate in any form. It had been hovering in the unsafe area in the 90s for years though, which no doc said a word about, or else it was 66, which isn’t good either as it still indicates glucose dysregulation.
But my insulin is low, rather than high.
I can’t believe how many at the NTH group who post for the first time and have fasting glucose labs in the 90′s and low 100′s whose docs haven’t said a word to them.
Caren
I find this particularly interesting.
I never was told I was insulin resistant or pre-diabetic.
I was also not told I was hypo for 20 years so my body suffered needlessly for too many years.
I was finally diagnosed hypo January 2010. That same time I was told I was diabetic. My Dr. wanted me to go on Metaformin but I refused because I didn’t think my numbers were bad enough to need the drug and I thought I could easily control with diet and exercise – which I did.
I have been on t3 since Aug 2011. All this time my blood sugars have gotten better and better.
Connection?
Yvonne
Sarah, many thanks for your post. I wonder if your daughter has tried daily topical application of magnesium oil to bring up her cellular magnesium levels? This has had dramatic results for some epileptics, reducing seizure activity or eliminating it. It’s safe, since any excess magnesium is cleared from the body through functioning kidneys.
Lyle McDonald on his Body Recomposition website says, “Probably the most relevant activator of AMPk is exercise and muscular contraction.” As a non-diabetic, I think I would try the simplest strategy, a moderate exercise program, before I would try a pharmaceutical drug like Metformin. All drugs have risks and contraindications.
K Dior
I don’t understand why Metformin is the only DRUG used to control pre-diabetes. That drug is something I cannot stand or take. I would have to quit my job or end up sitting on the toilet for the rest of my life with my laptop if I am to take that stuff again. I tried it four different times, different dosages and I still get sick. There HAS to be something else.
neeters
Metformin (aka metfartin lol) is hard on your guts but I found that by taking half a pill with each meal I had zero gas or the runs. if i take a whole pill, I get very bad symptoms. it is worth taking even just a small amount of Metformin for the anti aging effects of it. It has been shown to prevent cancers, helps preserve your beta cells since you are becoming more insulin sensitive while using it, and clears up fatty liver. I was an alcoholic for many years and damaged my liver, and then stopped, and became type 2 diabetic. with Metformin and weight loss I reversed that, but then Menopause and hypo T made me Insulin resistant again. while I never again had high sugars, I got very low sugars due to adrenals and untreated hypo, but while I was on adrenal meds and hormone therapy my brilliant hormone doc put me on half a metformin 3 times a day. Presto, no more low sugars. now I am stronger and started NDT and I am starting to feel like my old & younger self!
Andrea
Wow, Sarah, that is just brilliant. Thank you. My niece, who has been on meds for seizures since early childhood, has had weight problems her entire adult life and guess what just got a dx of hypothyroid, and I would bet anything she’s already insulin resistant.
I have had hypo and insulin resistance for years, was officially dx’d with T2D in 2008. Even with eating a low-carb diet, Metformin, and serious exercise, weight was always a struggle. About a year ago it was found I had high RT3 – what a relief that dx was, as I was feeling like total cr*p,had gained weight, and could not control my blood glucose (bg). [THANKS TO THE AMAZING JANIE BOWTHORPE WHO HELPED ME GET THROUGH THAT PERIOD.] Even though I had been taking Armour for years (but probably not enough I now realize), the high RT3 meant switching to T3 (Cytomel in my case). A year later I feel great and had lost 15 lbs (Just 3-5 more to go). BUT – my bg levels were still too high, especially in the morning, when they should be the lowest after an all-night fast. And my weight loss had stalled.
If this ever happens to you, you may be Leptin resistant – Leptin is the hormone that tells us when we have eaten enough, and if overweight is your issue, you may be resistant to it. Always being hungry is another sign. (I would fix any RT3 or thyroid dosage issues first, though, as I don’t think it’s possible to lose weight if you are under-treated with your hypo.) Dr. Jack Kruse has a Leptin Reset protocol that is a miracle – I am back in my size 6 clothes and would like to lose only another 3-5 lbs. The other miracle – my bg readings are coming down, from an am fasting average of 150 now to 125 (which is not even technical diabetic.) I expect that to continue to improve. So if weight gain / high blood sugar is an issue for you, even on Metformin and the right thyroid meds, check out the Leptin Reset http://jackkruse.com/easy-start-guide/
Thanks again Sarah and Janie!
Melissa Crozier
Hi Andrea! I’m interested to know where you live & who Janie Bowthorpe is?? We r struggling w/many of the same factors in my 18 yr. old daughter & are at wits end!! I suspect hypothyroid & PCOS!! Pls. help!
Dena
I am currently being treated for stage three adrenal fatigue. My doctor and I agree this is probably what took down my thyroid two years ago. I have forwarded this to him. I believe it is all very inter related. I will be checking the links you added. I also believe there is a stronge arguement in the lack of micronutrient in ou diet. We are on our third generation of processed food and chemical laden as well. I think they also play a role here.
Stacy Teitelbaum
I was diagnosed hypo right out of college and spent many years on synthroid. When having my 3rd baby, I was diagnosed as “gestational diabetic” but the numbers were so borderline that I suspect it was just insulin resistant from a decade on synthroid. The docs gave me a metformin-like drug that is safe during pregnancy, but I read the warning labels on it and it scared me to take it. So, since cortisol plays a role in letting insulin into the cells, I increased my dose of Isocort. My blood sugar readings came down, and I delivered a healthy baby.
I totally believe that thyroid/cortisol/insulin levels are interconnected. Very interesting article!
Karen
For those of you who want to try something else, study this paper (based on solid research):
http://raypeat.com/articles/articles/diabetes.shtml
And, this one:
http://raypeat.com/articles/articles/glycemia.shtml
And….:
http://raypeat.com/articles/articles/sugar-issues.shtml
Gail
I wish someone would hurry up and sort this out before both of my daughters (with high peroxidase) develop full blows hypothyroidism like me.
My thyroid has been so unstable over the last couple of years that, because of the constant constipation, I now have diverticular disease!!!
Patricia Dunlop
I need this explained more simply to me. Are you saying in this article that everyone who has hypothyroidism should be taking Metformin?
(From Janie: if she is, I don’t think everyone will agree. We all know that each of us has differing symptoms and connections with our hypothyroidism.)
Tom D.
I belive the author is on the right track but took a wrong turn. Insulin Resistance and Hypothyroid (possibly even Hashi’s) go hand in hand. The wrong turn occurs at Metformin. This just proves that a Low Carb-Gluten Free diet is absolutely essential in aiding the fight against Hypothyroidism.
(From Janie: Good points, but not sure that gluten-free is necessary for everyone with hypo, though….)
Gail
K Dior – my husband is type2DM and the doc wanted to put him on metformin, but when I read the side effects I looked for an alternative and came up with Gymnema Sylvestre an Indian herb. His Dr (my boss) poo pooed it, but after 2 years and good bloods, he just says ‘carry on doing what you’re doing’. In India they call it the sugar destroyer.
You have to have the 300mg for best efficacy – the brand I use is Swanson – it’s about £17 for 120 caps, and no side effects. You can take up to 3 a day, but do not take it with other diabetic meds as you risk having a hypo.
(From Janie: 300 mg a day, or each dose??)
Odette
I was recently diagnosed with PCOS and my gynae told me (without testing me) that I am probably insulin resistant – and put me on Inofolic, which he says does the same as Metformin, just without the side effects. My GP has now said I must have my thyroid and insulin tested, which Im doing tomorrow. Maybe worth looking into??
Gail
You can get 400mg caps or 300mg caps and the 300mg are the most efficacious. You can take up to 3 of the 300mg caps per day. Some people take it 15mins before food as a dietary aid.
‘They’ did tests on rats and it reversed the effects of diabetes on the pancreas.
Google it
Cathy
As a former Metformin with Armour user, I will tell you that it has horrible side effects….compared to a chemo drug. I was sick the entire six months I was on it. Fortunately, found a naturopathic physician who took me off of it and encoured me to research Met studies that had taken place in Asia….well I did and found out that Met completely depletes all Vitamin B sources in your body, yes, I found out the hard way. I had a full Spectracell done on all vitamins and minerals, ALL of my B’s were zero, after only six months. So remember, if you choose Metformin you need to increase your B’s so that you don’t end up depleted.
Karen Gardner
Need diabetes drugs to bring blood sugar down and have to take Armour (my thyroid removed). Armour is
making me anxious. Allergic to sulfa. Tried Januvia and Onglyza both made me depressed. I was fine on Armour for 12 years. Just trouble since metformin. Taking Vit D and B Complex and that helps. Going to try Nature Throid and see if that helps. Feel like I m losing my mind. Any advice. Karen
Heather
I was diagnosed hypo a few years ago by my GP and put on Synthroid only treatment. It improved my symptoms, but never did away with them completely. Eventually I started seeing an internist who is pro eastern and western medicine, and has recently started adding T3 treatment to my regimen of vitamins, minerals, and Synthroid after a year of diet changes and tests that consistently reveal elevated leptin and cortisol levels. He started me off on 5MG of liothyronine (T3), which I’ve already noticed has made a little bit of difference in things like easing constipation, dry skin, depression and anxiety. I need him to keep upping to dosage until I feel normal, but it’s a start. Before all this thyroid mess I had no issues with my weight. Now I have about 15 lbs laying around that won’t budge, but I’m hoping that the T3 treatment can help kick start my metabolism and alter my leptin and cortisol levels enough to get me back to normal.
SarahW
Dear all,
Thanks everyone for the comments, it’s as appreciated as it is unexpected.
Some observations:
Metformin is a very old remedy based on the herb “goats rue” http://www.thehealthierlife.co.uk/natural-health-articles/diabetes/goats-rue-plant-help-diabetics-00674.html
In its synthetic form as Metformin it does indeed have side effects but these can be lessened by using the extended release version (XR) and cutting down on processed carbs (of any sort).
Yes, Met can destroy B12 but that’s easy to prevent and resolve. Vegans may have a harder time than omnivores but B12 is a sensible supplement to take anyway IMHO.
Yes, we do take a high dose multi-mineral now. A gluten free diet for life can be low on minerals esp calcium and magnesium.
I am not in a position to recommend that anyone takes any drugs in any amount, that would be very unwise of me not having a medical qualification and you all having different circumstances. All I am suggesting is that a rational line of questioning with your doctor could well be “has being HT for so long made me insulin resistant?”
The Leptin Reset is part of the same metabolic switching issue as AMPK.
I can’t easily to do the US to Int’l blood sugar numbers but my daughter aims to stay steadily under 5 throughout the the day. At first the doctors were reluctant to treat because her sugar was only ever around 8/9 but over 6 and there were lots of fits. She also had tell tale Acanthosis Nigricans – brown skin on elbows and armpits which is another sign of IR – another example of where the numbers don’t always tell the truth.
You will see that IR has similar features to HT http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Insulin_resistance
So, my thinking is this: if any HT patient is technically overweight/obese, chubby in the middle, brain foggy and generally still feeling miserable, sick and tired then I think it is reasonable to ask a doctor who refuses to try NTH to ask instead for a short trial on a low dose of Metformin – especially as it is a globally approved (cheap) drug which they can prescribe without fear of losing their licence/insurance. It wouldn’t be the first time patient groups managed to nag doctors into submission, it’s exactly what happened over in the PCOS community.
If anyone is up to it then weight training rather than aerobics may be a way to go for keep fit because AMPK is activated by this type of exercise.
What we need, I believe, is a good academic to do the biology and statistics for us, explore these connections and bring them all together. Either that or find some body building friends!
BTW I am not suggesting giving up on T3 or NTH either, simply suggesting that we use the resources at our disposal and if we can’t get a doctor to try one thing then let’s try another way around to get the same result.
Kudos to Janie for the great site, let’s all keep plugging away for better health.
Emily
I am hypo and have been helped tremendously by this site. I am also very interested in the Paleo diet and metabolic syndrome. it has been very interesting to me to see more and more posts on STTP with very similar themes to those of the Paleo (or ancestral health) blogosphere.
I agree that insulin resistance and hypothyroidism seem to have commonalities. I think an alternative to taking more medications such as Met is a change in nutrition. Cutting out dairy and grains has drastically increased my energy level and I’ve lost 16lbs without trying.
Thank you for this site. It truly did save my life.
Terri Callahan
I actually tried the Metformin route several years ago — I had been hypothyroid for about 10 years, on Synthroid, fatigued, fat and sick most of the time. My glucose was 99 – borderline. My Endocrinologist put me on 1,000 mg of Metformin. In the first year or so, I did feel marginally better and I did lose some weight. But then the effects stopped. Also, the Metformin blocked my absorption of vitamins in foods and I went into a severe B12 deficiency. After about 1.5 years, all the weight came back, my hair continued to fall out and hypo symptoms were very bad. I recently got on NDT and am a lot better. I just don’t think Metformin is all it’s cracked up to be.
Karen Gardner
So what do you take now? They tried me on Januvia and then Onglyza and they gave me depression after a month so a diabetes specialist put me on extended release metformin 500 mg take before bed and it lowers my blood sugar but vitamin levels have dropped I take Vit D it s supposed to help your pancreas and Vit B Complex helps nerves and mood and now iron (take Hema-Plex from Health food store) very good. So i start the day with Armour then take all these vitamins. The metformin now on regular and taking 250 mg makes me hyper for a few hours everyday with my Armour but it works so well lowering blood sugar. I m allergic to sulpha and there is one whole group of diabetes drugs that have sulpha in them. Now they tell me my cortisol is high. The good news never ends. Just hope my kids don t get all this stuff. Karen Gardner
Lisa
Very interesting.
Along with insulin resistance, leptin resistance needs to be addressed. This can often be done very easily by doing a “leptin reset” diet, the general idea being that you eat a very large, high protein & high fat breakfast to start your day and do not snack, at all, between meals. There are several books and websites that go into depth on this topic.
The GAPS Diet has eliminated PCOS in several women that I know personally. It is worth looking into for someone with PCOS.
paulette
I am a 41 year old female who has had hypothyroidism for 30 years. A doctor put me on Armour when I was 37 and it made a dramatic difference for me. Then, last year a different doctor took me off (as my tsh tests show I had gone borderline hyper at .1)and put me on a low dose generic levo. 20 # and 6 months later, I finally realized that I needed a new doctor. I’m back on Armour, but I’m not sure if I need more or if there is something else going on. I exercise 3-5 days/week high intensity with strength training. I always feel like I’m going to die and I absolutely have no energy. I’m nauseous all day and want to lay down all the time. I have a healthy, mostly organic diet with lean meats, whole grains (early in the day), fresh fruits and lots of vegetables. My emotions are off the chart and my monthly cycles are more often than I prefer. Could the batch of levothyroid I took for awhile have turned me insulin resistant? I’m trying to figure out what the Heck is wrong with me.
(Go here: http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/adrenal-info)
Donna
I tried Metformin for a brief time – it made my borderline blood sugar higher. I went back to diet and my blood sugar went back down. I do have the symptoms of thyroid but always “pass” the tests ! Never been treated. My temp runs around 96 – 97 frequently. I am exhausted. Foggy brain – which is related to Fibromyalgia I’m told. It is very frustrating. I’ve been fighting this for years and don’t hardly bother to go to the doctor anymore. Tired of being told its in the head !
machteld schrameyer
I am not sure if this related although I expect it is. On this website I once found the name of the Holtorf Medical Group in California.
I did go there and was not happy with how they treated me, but they do use a system of resetting your body as far as losing weight is concerned by using a subtance used for diabetics. They claim to have a lot of success with this.
I have finally found relief after years of being on the verge of adrenal failure with the timing of my T3 as described in the book, on the website and with Vitamin C for heart palpatations, Vitamin B12 and most importantly the help of Dr. Winters, a chiropractor in Paducah KY who has a very good insight, especially with people like me who got very sensitive to everything. I do get DHEA drops and Pregnenelone drops, cannot tolerate Isocort, but have responded very well to his treatment. Feel almost normal after only a month. The first time I have felt hopeful after 12 years of trouble and 3 years on being on the verge of total collapse. His website already tells you about his experience with this issue.
Karen Gardner
Where did you get Isocort? I am on Armour Thyroid had my thyroid removed in 2000. Did fine until diagnosed with Type 2 Diabetes 6 months ago. After 3 med changes. I am on Metformin Er 500 mg in the evening. And I take 1/2 of. 15 mg Actos around 4 pm and then my second dose of Armour. My energy level is down. I get brain fog in the early afternoon but after I take my second dose of Armour I get energy and head clears. Do you have any advice. I do notice that I have energy when I don t take the Metformin and I can t cut it in half cause it s time release. I can only stop taking it for two days then my body wants it. Maybe I should try the Isocort. It worked for you. I ve changed my diet and my numbers are good. Someone suggested taking the Metformin every other day. Thanks.
Janie
Karen, one thing patients have learned repeatedly is to not start on any cortisol-containing supplement until one has done the 24 hour adrenal saliva test to make sure it’s needed. Here are patient groups: http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/talk-to-others
Karen Gardner
Hi Janie, I did have the saliva test for cortisol and the Naturopath said mine is high at 8 am and goes to 4 (should be 1.5) at 10 pm. Tried the phosphatidyl serine (had gingko bilboa in it) and had a stimulating effect. The GlucoFit he also gave me, Calmed me down. I took the Calm C P (that s phos serine without the gingko) and that was very calming but the next day I had the shakes and my blood sugar went high. I m afraid to take any more. I m taking Vitamin C ,B complex, zinc, to help with the adrenals. I have tried so much. I m going to see a holistic doctor who had given me Dhea compounded time release that took away migraines and it s helping me now. Karen
Lillian
It is refreshing to find a forum like this where information can be shared so that we can help each other. I am a Hashimoto’s patient who find it impossible to lose weight unless I reduce my food intake to 500-800 calories. I am on a gluten free diet and have made all of the dietary changes I know to do. I have always suspected insulin resistance and I am glad this issue is being discussed. I am also Type O blood and am curious to know if many of you out there are also Type o. We need to understand our condition and work together to “crack the code” because many women are suffering out there! I would also like to ask any of you out there if you have tried iodine with any success? The iodine actually has made my hypo symptoms worse.
keven mccord
great stuff
it is my firm belief that ther is NO such thing as type 2 diabetes that it is all thyridic in nature but it is more profitable to treat diabetes and hypertention and all the other related disorders than to CURE our thyroid disfunctions!!!! big pharma strikes again.
Kelly
I’m not sure if this is related but I think it is. I am wondering if there is anyone out there like me. I have ALWAYS (ALWAYS AWLAYS ALWAYS) consumed a diet of high sugar. I was taught/fed this from a very early age. My family was very poor and everything we ate came from a box.
As a teenager, I turned it up a notch and became very addicted to soda. I have been drinking soda (lots) for 20+ years.
Just this year, things got really bad healthwise. I was having symptoms of hypoT/PCOS. I started digging into all of the health issues that come with my high-sugar diet and, after reading 10+ books on how bad sugar, carbs and gluten were, I gave it all up cold turkey and switched to a Paleo diet with no carbs (except in vegetables) for 7+ weeks.
Two weeks after switching though, I started to experience something very odd. My body pretty much completely shutdown. I would sit in a chair and stare into space for hour. I would get fatigued from washing my hair or chewing food. My mind almost stopped thinking. I would actually be thinking about. . .nothing! I had zero energy. I was, in effect, “hibernating”. I was exactly like a zombie. Craziest thing ever! I couldn’t work. I couldn’t function.
I thought it was lack of calories so I would eat high volumes of food (only meat and vegetables though). And I would be stuffed full. But still completely fatigued.
Just recently, I changed my diet back to some soda again and some carbs and I have “come alive” again (still some bad days of zombie exhaustion though each week). I do believe this is a thyroid issue and sugar resistence issue. I just don’t know what to do. I really really want to be off the sugar but I am going to get fired from my job if I go back to how I was.
Recently, I convinced a doctor to prescribe a small dose of T3 (5mg). I’m wondering if a higher dose of T3 and a gluten free diet would be the answer. It was so hard to stop cold turkey the first time. I know it’s going to be a struggle again and I’m scared I’m going to back to zombie mode.
Erin Dunklin
I was totally normal and thin and had no problem with my thyroid that I know of before I got pregnant. I did have trouble getting pregnant and my OBGYN put me on Metformin and Clomid to get pregnant. 3 months of taking that and I was pregnant. I had the carpel tunnel syndrome during pregnancy and 3 months after delivery. It went away. I had placenta previa which went away at 18 weeks. I also had swelling of the legs, feet, and hands and pain when I would touch the inner thighs from my blood vessels being swollen during the third trimester of my pregnancy. Delivery was fine even though I had to be induced due to my water breaking and 24 hours later still in labor but no progress. After I of course started breastfeeding, and I lost my weight which at the time of delivery I weighed 164 and I went back down to my pre-pregnancy size of 134 in about 4 to 6 months. I did notice that I would get sick easier but other than that things were great. Until I got sick, my son got sick and then got thrush and passed it to me. Well we’d had several episodes of thrush while breastfeeding but this was the worst. It wouldn’t go away. I decided since he was almost a year old…10.5 months and I was having a hard time pumping milk and he was losing interest, it was a good time to wean him and put him totally on formula and milk. This is when my thyroid went all wacky on me. I noticed all the symptoms that was listed for the Hypothyroidism I had them. I gained 19 pounds back in a month, was so sluggish and tired that even a nap or sleeping long periods, caffeine, herbal energy pills, or exercise couldn’t revive me. When I exercised it got worse. I wasn’t eating a lot so I had no idea where the weight gain came from. I went to my doc and had my thyroid and hormone levels checked. My thyroid level was a 22…yes I have the complete test they did although I don’t believe it was quite as extensive as the one listed on here. So I need that done. But I was put on the generic of synthroid. I did notice a slight difference for the better, but no weight loss really, still sluggish, still no enegery, and about more than half the symptoms on the hypo list are still present. What I want to know is if this pregnancy induced hypothyroidism will go away eventually and I will normal out or am I doomed to live with this condition and have to resort to taking desiccated natural thyroid and synthroid for the rest of my life. Will it be reversed if I get pregnant again or get worse? Please help! I’m desparate! I hate the way I feel and look and want my old self back!
(http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/talk-to-others)
Toni
@Kelly __ Oh my, can I relate! I have had a weight problem all my life, though not quite the sugar addiction you describe. But I have experienced TWICE the “shutting down” that you describe.
The first time: I was in my 20′s and my mother took me to a clinic for the HCG diet. At the end, nice and thin, the clinic told me that to maintain the weight loss I needed to live on what is today called the Paleo diet. I loved being thin, and I avoided any carb unless it was a green leafy vegetable for two years! Health problems began to compound until the day when I stood looking at a flight of stairs and didn’t have the energy to lift my foot onto the first step. With what can only be called a supreme act of will, I made it up those stairs. Then I ate a single animal cracker cookie, and I felt a flood of energy coursing through my body. I knew I couldn’t stay on a no-carb diet any longer.
The second time: My weight bounced around the same 20-30 pounds after that, including through three pregnancies. Then I had my fourth baby. I tell her she is worth every pound, but I’m now 80 pounds heavier and cannot lose the weight. A few years ago, in my early 50′s, I read a diet that had you eat Paleo one day and low calorie/high carb the next. I was sure this would be my answer as the theory was you’d replenish your muscles on the high carb days. There were two problems: on the high-carb days I was a sugar fiend, and on the low-carb days I was paralyzed. My husband and my kids were so worried about me. I tried to tell them that I wasn’t sad or mad, but my body would just curl up into a cocoon and I couldn’t move.
I just wanted you to know that you’re not alone. Ultra low carb diets destroy my ability to move. It’s good to know that someone else knows what it’s like.
Andrea
I’ve been on TRH since February of this year, but weight is still an issue. I suspect it has to do with the on-off switch for AMPK which can be remedied thru Metformin (and mine’s been “off” for a long while).
I once took Metformin without the benefit of TRH and as I recall, it made me feel ill, no weight change.
I tested genetically as a low carber who benefits from high intensity exercise (InherentHealth.com) – in spite of a low carb diet and TRH (2 1/2 grains) + Isocort, my weight is steady.
I did see results when I had the energy to get to the gym and do 20 minutes 3 x week of high intensity exercise on an elliptical machine (which supposedly works as well as Metformin) – however, the key word is “energy”. My job leaves me too beat at the end of the day to hit the gym. I am going to try again now, since I have the summer off.
Also looking for a natural substitute for Metformin. Cinnamon has been mentioned.
For those ambivalent re: low carbing, here’s an article of interest –
http://www.cheeseslave.com/top-10-reasons-im-not-paleo/
Daniella cox
Berberine may be worth looking into it is a herb that can be used instead of metformin.
Kristen
I’ve struggled with hypo and PCOS, insulin resistance, all that. Finally just saw an endo (Dr. Gangi in Mesquite, TX) because I’m getting married this year and would like to get pregnant before it’s too late (I’m 32). After years of being on Levo but still being symptomatic even tho my “levels” were “normal” according to docs, the new doc told me my T3 was low, switched me from Levo to Synth (she says there’s a difference), lowered me from 125 mcg to 100, and put me on 10 mcg of Cytomel (which I started today) and sublingual B12 (I was B12-deficient anemic). I have tried both Armour and Metformin and had terrible reactions to both. The Met put me in the ER – I could barely walk I felt so bad. They were afraid I was acidotic (lactic acidosis is a rare but potentially fatal side effect of Metformin). Armour made me feel almost as bad. My mom loves it. I have seen websites full of people who had my experience with Armour. In the past few months progesterone cream has finally regulated my periods, but for years I had month-long (or longer) periods that were heavier than you can imagine. Plus my beautiful thick hair fell out almost completely, gained weight almost up to 300 lbs., and only lost it with a 100% zero carb (meat/dairy only) diet. Treating my insulin resistance with a diet that requires little to no insulin to digest has made my blood sugar rock steady and dropped 60 lbs. off my body in a year with no exercise. As of now I am doing my progesterone cream, eating zero carb, exercising daily, and taking the Synth/Cyto combo. I just started the Cyto today and it was like being on speed. I am going to talk to the doc about getting my dosage lowered for the time being. I am very optimistic about the addition of T3 to my treatment. I think the combination of Cyto/Synth with my diet, exercise, B12, and prenatal vitamins will help me get healthier and maybe God willing get pregnant. And look prettier at my wedding.
God bless all of you and may we all get the answers and treatment we need and deserve.
Adria
Great read, seriously! I was diagnosed with Hypothyroidism about 4 years ago, but after learning about the symptoms I’m quite sure I’ve had it for much longer. About 3 months ago I found out I have PCOS, am a celiac and pre diabetic. It’s been a bit rough coping with the information but mostly, it’s been harder to find a doctor that see’s how clear the connection is between all of these, I mean not only do the symptoms overlap, but there are plenty of other things that link them together.
I apologize as I don’t know the proper names in english for all my treatment, but I take levothyroxine (100 mcg), Novotiral (100mcg), Metformine (500 mcg) and Dicetel. Thus far my belly definitely feels better and I’ve been slowly losing some weight which is a huge plus. I have also changed my diet and eliminated gluten, it’s only been a few months so I am not really sure how much differences I should be seeing and feeling. However I do have to say that my energy level is at times where it used to be and at others, i simply feel like I have a giant rock over my shoulders.
Aside from all the meds I really try to focus on keeping a healthy diet and finding other natural stimulants like wheatgrass shots and umeboshi (japanese plum), but If anyone has any other tips, advice I’d be more than greatful.
All the best!
(From Janie: I don’t understand why you are on BOTH T4-only and a combo of T4/T3! It’s only the latter that’s needed, and Natural desiccated thyroid is even better. Join patient groups: http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/talk-to-others)
Jane
Broda Barnes figured this out long ago, see chapter in his book “Hypothyroidism The Unsuspected Illness”
Christina
So interesting-thank you for researching and posting.
I have PCOS, hypothryoid and insulin resistance, as well as gluten intolerance. It’s been a journey the past couple of years trying to piece it all together. My thryoid appears to be in a good range now on Armour. I tested negative for all of the auto-immune thyroid issues.
I started taking Metformin a few months ago for the PCOS and insulin resistance to try to regulate my very irregular cycles. The first 10 weeks on Metformin were absolutely horrible with side effects, but now the side effects are much more tolerable (just some food aversion and mild nausea and mild exhaustion from time to time). Metformin did, however, regulate my cycles right away, something I had been trying to do on my own for 1.5 years with no success.
It seems like iodine could play a role in all of this too from research I have done. I had my iodine level tested, and it was super low, so I am working on building back up my iodine levels. Since my thyroid problem is not Hashimoto’s or Graves, I really think it could have a root in the iodine deficiency.
Sheena
Wow, this all makes total sense…I have just been diagnosed with PCOS, hypothyroidism and insulin resistance all at the same time. It’s scary how interrelated all of these things are. I’m hoping that after reading this, I might be able to reduce from 3 meds to 1! Here’s hoping my doctor will listen!
Susan Silverstrom
Hello. I am interested in finding out more about Stopping the Thyroid Madness!!
April P.
Hi everyone. What a great post! I have had hypoT for 6+ years but just yesterday was dx’ed with Hashi’s. My fasting BG has steadily increased over the last few years (from about 79 to 97). My dad has Type 2 diabetes and I think I have PCOS (based on symptoms–I have almost all of them). 2 years ago I managed to lose 50+ pounds on my own with a low carb diet, exercising/walking, and taking a ton of natural supplements. They included alpha lipoic acid, NAC, magnesium, B-complex, omega 3′s, biotin, chromium, vit D, gymnema sylvestre, and a natural herbal formula for healthy ovarian function called Femtrol. Most of these have been studied for glucose management. I was also on 175mcg synthroid at the time. I managed to lose that weight in 4 months. I felt great. Periods were normal. Lab work looked great. Unfortunately, I got lazy with exercising, my diet, and taking the supplements and have gained most of that weight back. I understand the importance of food, supplements, and movement!! I am currently on 200mcg synthroid and still showing symptoms. Their answer has been to only increase synthroid and prescribe Metformin but seeing how sick my dad was on it makes me not want to take it! I hope that with my new dx of Hashi’s and a new doctor I can change to Armour and lose more weight and hopefully lower my fasting BG levels. I bought a book called “Practical Paleo” by Diane Sanfilippo and she has sections for diet recommendations based on condition (she has a thyroid section, autoimmune section, and weight loss/blood sugar balance), and recommends NO GLUTEN. I highly recommend her book! I have also recently enrolled in a 6 month program with a local thyroid specialty doctor and one of the first things he told me is to avoid gluten. Leaky gut is connected to thyroid imbalances and can be caused my ingesting gluten and other irritants.
Shawna
These stories are amazing! I recently started looking into thyroid conditions after my sister, who has suffered with Hashimotos and Celiac disease was recently diagnosed with another thyroid condition called “thyroid hormone resistance”. We are from Montana, so she is looking at specialists in other states since doctors here are having trouble treating her. There are several cousins that have Celiac disease and one with Hashimotos, as well. For years, I have thought that I have hypothytoidism but my lab tests always come back “normal”. Now, after stumbling upon this post about Insulin Resistance and the thyroid, I’m wondering about my daughter. Last year, at 17 she was diagnosed with Insulin Dependent Type 1 Diabetes (no family history) and just a month ago was diagnosed with Celiac, no surprise with the family history, but her thyroid test was normal. So, within a year’s time she was diagnosed with Diabetes and Celiac, could this be a connection to the thyroid? Plus, she is still fatigued and has gained around 30 pounds. She works at a fitness club and tries to work out but most days is too tired. Also, somewhere on this website it stated that, Hashimotos can be diagnosed as Bi-Polar, and two years ago that’s what my daughter was diagnosed with (Bi-Polar II Mood Disorder) and prescribed an anti-seizure drug. She continues to take the anti-seizure drug but maybe she’s taking the wrong medication. Over the last couple of years my daughter has been to a counselor, then psychiatric nurse, plus numerous doctors before her Diabetes was diagnosed. Does anyone have or know of anyone with similar circumstances? Or any advice?
Jill Smith
Hello, I was born with Hypothyroidism and they did not find it till I was 3 and now I am 55 and the doctor took me off of the armour which is natural and put me on Levothyroid and cymotel well she took me off of the cymotel and she did the sugary test on me and my 3 to 6 months test was high and now she has me on Metformim and I am not losing any weight I am gaining and my hair is coming out not in chunks but more than it should so I do not agree with the Metformin deal it may work for some but please do not suggest it works for everyone ! Every one body is not the same and does not react the same way so just cause you searched a lot does not mean we have all the answers !
(From Janie: your problems may be more due to being left on nothing more than levothyroxine than a problem with Metformin. http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/t4-only-meds-dont-work )
Danielle
Thank you for this. I have been fighting to get my thyroid regulated for over 4 yrs now. Every dr i see wants to only try synthroid and nothing else. While it has helped, it still has not fully worked. I have infertility issues too. I was diagnosed with PCOS three yrs ago, but i think it is odd that in those three yrs, they have never found one cyst on either of my ovaries. I think it is a generic diagnosis because they cannot figure out what to do with me. I also have hypoglycemia (that gets worse every yr). I know several women who have hypothyroidism and their docs have treated them with metformin and it has helped but i begged for metformin and am told it will not help me. I just dont know what to do anymore.
(From Janie: for one, say many, many patients, get off Synthroid and onto desiccated thyroid, and learn about adrenals and iron from the STTM book.)
Rachel
Hello! What a relief to know I am not alone! I am 32, have had a dx of pcos for 10 years, and hypoT for about a year. I currently take synthroid, .75mcg. I feel horrible! My hair is gone..it just falls out my body feels as if it was ran over by a semi, my hands and arms are numb,& I am huge(very overweight and swollen) I can go on and on…but I wont. I really just need help so bad… I have no idea what to do, or what to tell my Dr. to do. I have taken Met. For many years on and off, I hate it with a passion it does nothibg for me. If anyone has any advice I would be so thankful, I see my Dr. in two days.
From Janie: http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/talk-to-others
Connie
A friend casually remarked about the symptoms of insulin resistance and the symptoms all sounded so familiar. But I ate hardly any sweets – how could this be? I started the paleo diet – NO GRAINS, NO PASTA, NO BREAD. Within a week my energy level was up and after two I finally actually lost a pound. My friend explained that bread, etc. is quickly converted to sugars. Since I was a vegetarian many of my calories came from this. I started eating meat when I started the paleo diet. This upped my protein levels as well. As I was running yesterday suddenly it occurred to me that the insulin resistance and the hypothyroidism were connected. When I typed in the searchI found this page (and lots of research hits as well). Thanks for the corroboration of my hunch, and all the great info. Now I am wondering about next steps..
(From Janie: I’ve just received word from a progressive doc that he’s seen some of his diabetic patients have their sugar levels go down 20 pts thanks to being on natural desiccated thyroid for their hypo!)
Ian
K. Dior
I used to have diarrhea when starting the metformin , which is a common side effect.I would always give up after a few days of constantly running to the bathroom. Then I read that it can take up to 2 weeks to get used to metformin. When I finally decided to keep at it, the diarrhea eventually stopped. For me it was 2 weeks. Also, it helps if you take it with food and never on an empty stomach. At least, that is my experience.
Ian
Isabelle
I echo the comment posted regarding Dr. Broda Barnes, M.D. discovery. The bottom line is: untreated hypothyroidism leads to diabetes. He also treated what is called hyperthyroidism with dessicated thyroid (i.e. Armour). It’s been many years since I read the book, but it was a life saver. All thyroid problems needed treatment with Armour and he did this successfully.
My personal experience is my heart will race WITHOUT my thyroid meds. It also races a day or two adjusting to getting them when I’ve been without for a long time. I was without thyroid Rx for long periods when I was trying to find a suitable replacement for the old Armour and had not been successful. My experience so far is NOTHING matches how well the old Armour worked. The info STTM has on selenium, however, helped my Erfa Rx to start to actually work. I had chewed it up for a year with no real results particularly with bloat/edema resulting in being far too overweight. I also have to take the selenium with pumpkin (I just use canned) for the nutrients needed to absorb and utilize the selenium. I never had to go to all this trouble with the old Armour, but at this point, I’ll do what it takes to get thyroid Rx to WORK.
Isabelle
PS: I also should note Dr. Barnes put his patients on higher fat diets. I’m presuming this would be good fats/essential fatty acids which help us lose weight. He was also doing this during a time when food had more nutrition and no GMOs and poisons like we do today.