Part II: Erfa Canada says new thyroid pills are fine: Thyroid Patients worldwide exclaim HOG WASH!!

Screen Shot 2014-05-26 at 2.41.49 PMAnother nightmare for thyroid patients who depend on Natural Desiccated Thyroid.

If you are new to this subject, 2014 saw new batches of the Canadian Erfa Thyroid come out, along with patients worldwide reporting a return of hypothyroid symptoms in the worst way…sooner or later. It was eerily similar to what happened with Armour thyroid in 2009 after Forest Labs changed the way the pill was made. You can read about this travesty with Erfa Thyroid on the following May 8, 2014 blog post page, here: http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/2014/05/08/dear-erfa-canada-stop-nonsense-change-desiccated-thyroid-back/  It is followed by a massive amount of posts, comparing batch numbers as well as symptoms which have returned. It’s all a must read!

This morning, I received a message from a thyroid patient who heard from Dr. Knafo, the Medical Director at Erfa Canada 2012 Inc. He stated to her:

We just received all the retesting on the product and everything looks fine on our end. Did you have a blood test done ?

In other words, when you look at his last question, the implication is the same that has been stated to others: that the symptoms which she has seen return on the new Erfa Thyroid are about HER, not about the pills.

But we also now have an official announcement from Dr. Knafo, and is exactly what I feared would be stated: 

Dear All,

I wanted to thank all of you for your response and wanted to update you on the results we got from the retesting done by an independent lab. All the side effects reported were sent to Health Canada and all the retesting were done by a reputable independent lab.

We got about 70 patients reporting to us and there was 55 lack of efficacy reports. Half of the time we had the lot number and we could do an analysis of which lot were involved. There was NO relations between the batches involved and the side effects reported as many batches (50%) were trace back to our older production. Regardless, we decided to retest the batches that were involved (both from the older factory and new one) and sent everything to an independent lab.

There was no difference in concentration from one batch to the other. We did not change our formulation, suppliers nor our manufacturing technique.

We have over 10,000 patients in Canada only and reports from Canadian patients were much less in numbers. We cannot explain why many of you are experiencing those symptoms however I think the right approach is to take every single case separately and understand if there is no other variables involved. The number of reports are however consistent with the increase of sale (we sold 3 times more Thyroid in the past year).

The test results are available in our office for anyone that wants to consult them.

I hope this update clarify a bit more the situation and action we put in place. Please feel free to contact me anytime.
Regards,

Dr H. Knafo
Medical Director ERFA Canada 2012 inc.

And I want to make my response to Dr. Knafo public here:

Dear Dr. Knafo,

Thank you for the kind way in which you expressed yourself concerning the testing of the “new” Erfa Thyroid by an Independent lab.

I want to underscore to you that the reason Erfa has seen a three-fold increase in its sales last year is because Erfa used to be a great product for all involved. Patients had found it to be as excellent as the “old” Armour used to be for decades, plus they have always loved that they can do Erfa Thyroid sublingually. Additionally, many patients in Europe have had access to Erfa, which was important when knowledge about Natural Desiccated Thyroid is so pitiful in Europe.

Understand that I have worked directly with patients for 12 years as an activist for better thyroid treatment. Natural Desiccated Thyroid (NDT) changes lives and is proven over and over by worldwide patient experiences to be a much better hypothyroid treatment than T4-only. It even edges out the combination of T4 and T3 by its positive effects!

Granted, there are many patients who have reported not doing well on NDT over the past decade. But that wasn’t because NDT didn’t work. We figured out early on that there are two main reasons why NDT may not seem to work: a cortisol issue (low or high), and/or low iron. So patients learned that they must get the right testing for both of those, know how to read the results, and treat both before they will do well with NDT. You can read about all this here: http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/ndt-doesnt-work-for-me

And of course, some reported NDT not working because they were being held hostage to the TSH lab test, which we as informed patients know is the WORST test to be dosed by. You will remain under-dosed if a doctor goes by the TSH range. Read this: http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/tsh-why-its-useless

So because of all the above, I had to discern if all these complaints about the “new” Erfa Thyroid were actually because of any of the above.

But Dr. Knafo, I quickly saw that no, the vast majority were not. The bulk of complaints…and bad experiences…have been coming from patients who were doing wonderfully on Erfa Thyroid for awhile, only to see their symptoms return exactly when they started using the pills that were now being made at a different facility.

You stated in your announcement: There was no difference in concentration from one batch to the other. We did not change our formulation, suppliers nor our manufacturing technique. What is missing from that statement is that you have, in fact, stated to others than Erfa Thyroid did change the facility in which the pills are made. And as far as the “manufacturing technique”…patients clearly see a difference in the “new” batches. They are now slightly shinier, the indentations are deeper, and the new pills have a blotchy look that wasn’t there before.

The photo above shows the difference between the old and new.

Of course, we don’t know if what we are observing in the new pills explains anything. All patients DO know is that all-too-many of them are seeing their hypothyroidism return with the new Erfa Thyroid.

I think you are a sincere man, Dr. Knafo. We appreciate that about you. But…something has, in fact, changed in Erfa Thyroid. And to dismiss the growing overall body of patients worldwide who are not doing well anymore on Erfa thyroid is a bad move, just as it’s insensitive to state that that there are no other variables involved so thus, it must be about the individual circumstances.

Sincerely,

Janie A. Bowthorpe. M.Ed.
http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com
https://www.facebook.com/StoptheThyroidMadness
http://www.laughinggrapepublishing.com

P.S. Go back and read all the comments on the May 8th blog post linked above. It’s patently clear that the new Erfa Thyroid has changed, whether testing says otherwise.

UPDATE: thyroid patient S. compiled the following as of August 2015 and these represent expiration dates:

The good batches (no one reported them as bad, and one or more people reported them as good) are: 8/15 (reported by 3 people) and 4/17 (4 reports).

Some batches were reported as both good and bad by different people: 5/17, 7/17, 7/16, 2/17, 10/16, 3/15.

Some were reported only as bad: 11/15 (3 reports); 11/17 (1 report); 3/16 (3 reports); 8/17 (3 reports).

No reports for 1/17, 3/17 or 6/17 so these are unknown.

1,195 Responses to “Part II: Erfa Canada says new thyroid pills are fine: Thyroid Patients worldwide exclaim HOG WASH!!”

  1. Myriam P.

    It’s such a shame… I was so happy to finally get my doctor to prescribe me some Erfa and now I have to switch to another medication. It goes without saying that we don’t have tons of options in Canada for NDT. I hope we’ll hear more from Dr. Knafo. Thank you so much for the update.

    Reply
  2. Clare

    I think we need to see the full report referenced in Erfa’s statement to confirm which lots were tested.

    Reply
  3. Patricia Dunlop

    I have been taking Thyroid by Erfa for 10 years. I think I know by now whether it is working or not. It is not working now. I am done fooling around with my health. I am making other arrangements. I do not intend to crash to prove a point. You are going to lose many customers – not just me.

    Reply
  4. Toni

    I have some from Oct ’13 and got a new batch from March ’14, which I haven’t taken yet. They look the same, no blotches or shininess. Fingers crossed, but I am already thinking of what I will switch to!

    Reply
  5. Angie

    Absolutely I want to see the testing that was done.. I hope that it did not begin and end with a comparison of T4 and T3 concentrations. Suggest that the batches where problems were reported be tested via some sort of mass spectrometry (High Resolution, Gas Chromatograph, or Liquid Chromatography) for organic consituents as well as testing for heavy metal contamination. While my labs were not an issue, I visited my primary care physician twice with symptoms that dissipated when I changed form the “new” ERFA to Nature-throid. An important note to be made is that only about 25% of a given customer demographic will take the time and trouble to complain. So the actual number (and I believe I read around 170+ comments) for those having problems is likely far greater. Knafo is a class act, but ERFA is not digging into this the way that they should, IMHO. Both Knafo and his company need to realize that the increase in sales is likely to become a decrease with the loss of STTM endorsement as well as the endorsement of long-time, experienced NDT users.

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      Excellent points, Angie….

      Reply
      • Angie

        Thank you, Janie..I sent the above to Dr. Knafo on the 12th and have yet to receive a response. Please let us know if/when you get the actual results of testing that ERFA is saying they have done.

        Reply
  6. Sandra

    When I advised my pharmacist of the change in your “Thyroid” pills he told me that “ANY” change to a drug, not just the formulation but the actual compression of the pill or the coating of a pill warrants a direct notification from the manufacturer to them so they can advise their customers. You have offered different explanations Dr. Knafo to different people at different times during this process, no formula change just the manufacturing facility, no formula change just a new machine compressing the tablets, and to a pharmacist themselves, no formula change just a supplier change and it is clear that you have added a coating of some sort and that is a CHANGE! So to say that it must be those individuals and other issues is a crock and a cop out.
    With great fear I am about to start a batch of your new shiny pills and if I start to feel worse than I already do then you will have lost me as a customer and my mother as well.
    Shame on your company for not taking responsibility for this disaster.

    Reply
  7. Mary Garito

    I had heard about the ERFA situation from your excellent site. So I switched to NP Thyroid before ever refilling my next ERFA order. Since then I have been feeling great and I am saving about $40/month. I should have done it sooner!

    Also, great letter to Dr. Knafo. Thank you Janie!

    Reply
    • Lauren

      Hi, Mary … what is NP Thyroid? Do you live in Canada, or the US?

      Reply
  8. Tiffany

    I was on Erfa for over 5 years and jumped threw all the red tape to get it sent here in the US as well pay all out of pocket on top of it all! I did this because I LOVED how I felt on it. I am so disappointed in the company to say the least. I knew this was coming. I have already gone through the new process of changing to WP Thyroid in the states instead. I actually picked them up today! I will start them tomorrow!! =) Instead of paying over $100 dollars and waiting weeks, I got me new script for $28 in TWO days! WOW! I guess when sales start to drop maybe then Erfa will take notice. I now no longer recommend Erfa. What a shame!!

    Reply
    • Clare

      Tiffany – did you order WP online or pick up in person? Did your insurance cover it? I’m looking into this myself, and looking for any information I can find. Thanks!

      Reply
    • Lauren

      Tiffany, my situation is almost identical to yours. I live in the US — near Los Angeles. Can you tell meore about the WP Thyroid product you switched to? I have been taking Erfa 125mg. Any info you can provide would be very appreciated. Thank you!

      Reply
  9. Alenka

    If different tablet presses have been used, there is a possibility of the new tablets being firmer, harder, which could influence the absorption. Especially when not taken sublingually. This is something that the retesting of the tablets can’t reveal.

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      Very true, Alenka, as we saw this with Armour….

      Reply
      • Clare

        I’m not convinced it’s simply an absorption issue. I did a trial and added a 1/2 grain to my usual compounded NDT dose and immediately felt a reaction (pain) to it.

        Reply
  10. Julie

    I have been on Erfa for many years and did great up until this last year. I couldn’t figure out why all my hypo symptoms came screaming back. I got brain fog, chronic fatigue, myalgias, constipation, etc. The list goes on and on. I had not heard that Erfa had been reformulated until today. Now it all makes sense.
    I have already switched from Erfa a couple months ago to Naturethroid Pure and already feeling better.

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      Julie, you are an example of those thousands out there who are cited as not having complained yet….but it’s probably because they don’t even know what has gone on…yet…or they are still on the old Erfa. 🙁

      Reply
    • Lauren

      Hi. Julie. Could you please be so kind as to tell me a bit more about the product you switched to? I’m not even familiar with the name. I’ve been taking Erfa 125 mg. for several years. I have some left in the bottle (refilled Nov. 2013), but I need make a plan – now – for what I’m going to do when these are used up, and I need to do it fast! I live in the US, near Los Angeles. Any suggestions/advice you can give me would be appreciated. Thank you!

      Reply
    • Debra

      Where are you able to purchase nature thyroid pure at? I am from Canada.

      Reply
  11. waveylines

    Thank you Janie for all your efforts.

    I think this is a really disappointing response. I take real offense that Dr Knafo does not seem to realise that he is talking to many experienced users of their product – Erfa Thyroid -I absoloutley know that what i am experiencing without doubt is a re-emergence of my thyroid symptoms -these are not due to some other ’cause!’ Shame on Erfa for not taking us more seriously.
    My GP has offered to get the tablets tested over here in the UK -am now tempted to do so. frankly the upshot of all of this is loss of faith in the company themselves -who is going to trust a company who blames the patient as having ‘individual needs’ whilst acknowldeging they have had 70 compaints!!!
    Their sales may have tripled inthe last year but what goes up comes down when you don’t take patients complaints seriously.
    I as many others will move across to another NDT that is effective and importantly reliable -am not prepared to carry on gaining masses of weight, be consitpated, crashing after a little exertion exhausted for days, swollen ankles, swollen tongue, dry blurred eyes, indigestion, dry skin, inability to think straight with my hair falling out. Dr Knafo these are classic Hypothyroid symptoms in case you are not aware – there is nothing more mysterious or ‘individual’ than that!! Good effective thyroid treatment will resolve these symptoms as you well know! What a very sad day…..

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      Great post, Waveylines and yes, this is sad. The re-emergence of thyroid symptoms has been extremely common with many intelligent and informed patients worldwide, and the vast majority of the reports aren’t pointing to a cortisol or iron problem. They are pointing to a change in the pill itself…whatever that change has been. Yes, it’s a sad day for all of you who trusted and appreciated Erfa Canada…

      Reply
      • Lauren

        Janie, what thyroid med do you use? It’s probably common knowledge, or named on this thread somewhere, so I’m sorry to ask you, but I do not know. 🙂

        Reply
    • Dianne

      waveylines, please consider taking your GP up on his/her offer to run tests on the new and old ERFA. I would love to get to the truth of the matter somehow! Thank you.

      Reply
      • waveylines

        Hi Diane. I will ask my GP 2 to get my tablets analysed – I have some from both the last 125g lots. None from the ones I felt well on. Today I feel so ill all I can do is lay down. I feel so angry as I have no option but to carry on taking Erfa until I can another brand to switch to.. Dr Knafo when you say there is no correlation between the lots how come I have had three people on the same lot as me contacting me to say how ill they feel. All of us on the 125 gramme tablets. I have no option now but 2 get myself signed off sick from work. Also why haven’t you answered my last three emails when you have told us to contact you if we still have concerns?
        Dr Knafo we need this resolving not ignoring.

        Reply
      • waveylines

        Hi Dianne,
        I will take my GP up on his offer to test the tablets -I feel so terrible I can’t go on like this, I slept for hours yesterday and am in so much pain – am desperate to swtich. I feel like I am not on thyroid meds at all. I bumped my dose up 1 & 1 /2 grains yesterday -made no difference. I have tablets from the last two batches of 125g…..I was going to ask him if he would check not only the T4/T3 but also the content. Last time I reacted like this I was on Armour when they changed the formulation and increased the cellulose…..I can only think there is a change in the fillers/procssing that clearly Dr Knafo is not yet aware of. Somethig is definately not right!

        Reply
        • Dianne

          I’m sorry you feel so terrible, waveylines. There are no words to describe how disasterous and unforgiveable this ERFA… fiasco has been. I also feel there has been an ingredient(s) change. Thank you for asking your GP to test the ingredients for us. Let us know what they find.

          Reply
  12. Lynn

    I’ve been wondering why I’m so exhausted all the time. I switched to Erfa when Armour shortages made it impossible to get my scrips filled. What a difference it made.

    Now, come 2 pm I can hardly lift my head it feels so heavy. It seems they’ve changed their manufacturing. Yeah, that’s what Forrest Labs said too.

    Great, I guess that means I’m going to be changing the brand I buy. I’d be elated that I finally figured out why I’m so exhausted all the time again but I’m too tired to care. I’ll find something new and the bustards’ll do it again and blame the exhaustion on me because it’s always the patient’s fault.

    May they all come down with Hashis.

    Cheers.

    Reply
  13. Sarah salmon

    I am devastated by this. I live in the Uk and ERFA thyroid is the only medication I have felt well on. The last 3 months has been hell and I am ill again. When oh when will drug companies start putting people’s health before their profit margins. It’s a disgrace to suggest that all these people who have complained about the return of their ill health are somehow imagining it. It cannot be a coincidence!!!
    I will now lose months of my life again whilst searching for another NDT that I can take. I’ve already tried 4 different ones and the side effects are awful. I had such faith in ERFA. I feel such an idiot now.

    Reply
  14. Karen Tavasci

    Hello,
    So, with my ERFA now compromised also, which is the purest NDT out there?

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      Karen, all the rest of the NDT’s work, but each person might have their favorites. NP Thyroid appears to be very successful—it’s made like the old Armour and you can do it sublingually. WP Thyroid has the least fillers and you can do it sublingually. Naturethroid is also still successful—you can’t do it sublingually very well, though, if that is important to you.

      Reply
      • Thea

        Hi, I’ve been reading but not commenting because my pharmacist is still using one of the old bottles, as far as I can tell from the pictures of the pills, and will be for a while longer.

        But I wonder, Janie, if you’d let us know in Canada what other brands are available here, if there are any. I’m in a Google search right now, but it’s not looking fruitful so far; and my pharmacist says Erfa is the only NDT available here. I hope you can prove him wrong too!

        Thank you for all the newsletters, all the work on our behalf.

        Reply
        • Sandra

          Hi Thea,
          I too am in Canada and Janie suggested to google Thyrogold and will do that but my pharmacist said they can compound natural thyroid hormone. Go to the first post on this situation that Janie created and there is a link to other options and in that list gives the guidelines for what to watch out for when ordering compounded formulation.
          Good luck to us all!

          Reply
      • Sonia

        Seconding Thea’s request, any info on alternatives available in Canada would be greatly appreciated.

        I’m sorry that Erfa is not taking this as seriously as they should, I am certain there will be a significant drop in sales now for them. It would be a different case if there was effort to pinpoint the difference, acknowledge it, and correct it. But I am not willing to even give benefit of doubt anymore and will not return to the brand in the future … it’s a trust issue now as well. My problem is, what the heck do I replace it with? I never felt well on synthoid, felt great on Erfa Thyroid until 6 weeks ago, and feel like I am out of options.

        Reply
      • Lauren

        Thank you for this info, Janie! Do you happen to know if these are available at Pharmacies in the United States? Thank you!

        Reply
  15. Cynthia

    I’m not surprised by Dr. Knafo’s letter. After all, should ERFA admit that anything is amiss, they open themselves up to a huge liability. It’s always about the $$$, isn’t it?
    I actually expected to hear from ERFA that the T4/T3 concentrations were all okay in the suspect batches. That may be so – but there is no information about the other raw product – and the possibility of toxins/contamination with that. That’s where I think the problem stems from.
    And here’s another theory of mine: I have been diagnosed with Celiac Disease just recently and my symptoms all got worse with my first bad batch of ERFA around the first of the year. I read yesterday that sometimes a medication can “trigger” latent celiac disease into full-blown “bomb going off” celiac. This appears to be what happened to me because of BAD ERFA.
    We know from the medical literature that there is a strong connection between celiac disease/gluten intolerance and Hashimoto’s Thyroiditis. I would encourage every person who has been negatively affected by the BAD ERFA to have a blood celiac panel done as well as genetic testing. I can recommend Enterolab’s genetic test.

    Janie, I sincerely thank you for being the thyroid advocate who has been unafraid to blog about this and attempt to help those of us who have suffered such a health setback. Sadly, just as I know it was with the 2009 Armour fiasco, there are folks out there who have gotten sick from the BAD ERFA and don’t know there is a problem. Furthermore, I suspect that as these bad batches get into the market, there will be more reports from patients.

    Me, I’ve switched to another brand of desiccated thyroid after being on ERFA since 2009. I don’t think I’ll be going back to ERFA. Integrity is important to me – and for this company to say nothing is wrong – well that’s a lie – and a life-threatening lie to we patients who depended on ERFA. Good riddance to them – and although I’m not ordinarily mean-spirited, I’m hoping their company goes down in flames…

    Reply
  16. Heather

    I just went to my NP Doctor 2 days ago (she treats allergies etc) and with all my pills she tests them first to see if I’m allergic to them. I gave her my new erfa prescription and she tested me and said I had an allergy to them and shouldn’t take them. Then she tested the old ones and said they were fine, and both of us were scratching our heads as to why this would be happening. Now after reading what has happened to everyone else, it makes sense! I’m fortunate to have 1 week of the old erfa left, and I’m hoping it gives me enough time to switch over to another brand. I’m not waiting around for them to fix it, they have lost me as a customer!

    Reply
    • Dianne

      Heather, that is good information to know about the allergy testing by your NP of the new and old ERFA. Not that I needed confirmation to know that there is some ingredient or ingredients in new ERFA that are causing reactions and hypo symptoms for some people. How many?

      Reply
    • Sonia

      I had the same thing done … the 125mg (new pills) were “toxic” for me according to the testing done. However, old 30mg tablets were fine (with optimum dosing at 4 of those for 120mg). I’ll be out of the 30s in about a week though, and have no idea what to do after that.

      Reply
  17. Dianne

    Like other people, I’m not surprised by Dr. Knafo’s response. I was expecting it. Afterall, ‘there has been no change in formulation’, has been ERFA’s claim all along, and they are sticking to their story. The ‘tests’ sound like a joke, to be frank. Dr. Knafo says, ‘There was no difference in concentration from one batch to the other.” So, it sounds like all they looked at was the concentration in all the batches. (?) Then he says, ” We did not change our formulation, suppliers nor our manufacturing technique.” This doesn’t sound like a result from testing, this is just the same line Dr. Knafo has been saying all along. Did they test for toxins/contaminants/heavy metals; did they compare the exact ingredients of new ERFA with the same ingredients from the tried and true formula they’ve used for years? Certainly doesn’t sound like it? Can you please post the test results for all of us to see, Dr. Knafo?

    And, so again, I’m insulted and frustrated and yes, devastated, by how ERFA has handled this disaster. It isn’t necessarily a disaster to them because, hey, ERFA has increased its customer volume in the last year. So that means more money for ERFA. And the loss of just one of the 10,000 Canadian customers is not important. What is important to ME is that ERFA Thyroid is the only prescribed ndt in Canada. There is no other alternative for me. And, I will not poison myself by taking new ERFA. I felt like I was dying on it.

    ERFA, there is something drastically wrong with the new ERFA Thyroid, and I feel it is, at the least, unethical to supply this medication to the public. And, I’m sorry, but the whole situation has felt underhanded and dishonest. I lost some of my trust in ERFA when I first contacted you about the reaction I was having to new ERFA back in January, and was told nothing had changed with the formulation. Now I’ve lost complete trust after reading this brushed over statement about the ‘test results’.

    Reply
  18. Yvonne

    Dear Janie and readers,
    I’m not affected by the ERFA reformulation, as I buy Thiroyd from Thailand. But I want to ask, have any of you tried crushing a tablet between two spoons, adding a bit of sugar or dextrose (found in the baby aisle at the supermarket) and tucking it in between your cheek and gum? This isn’t a great solution, but it might help somebody survive with their current supplies until they can find a better brand.
    Yvonne

    Reply
    • Sandra

      Hi Yvonne,
      Do you know if your’s can be ordered into Canada? Can you forward any information where to order etc to us here so we can look at that as an option?
      That would be greatly appreciated.
      thank you

      Reply
      • Samirah

        Hi Sandra, I’m pretty sure, that YES Thiroyd and Thyroid-S, both from Thailand I believe and sold by the same person can be shipped into Canada, as it is looked at as a supplement. If you are on facebook they have groups you can “like” for Thyroid-S and Thiroyd, and it gives contact information to order the pills. Or I’m sure you could also google it and find some info on the pills as well.

        Reply
        • Sandra

          Hi Samirah,
          I just saw your reply so thank you very much for your reply, I will check into that.

          Reply
        • Sandra

          Hi again,
          I am now feeling quite desparate as I have been getting worse. I was wondering if you see this, can you tell me why you think I can order it into Canada? I just tried to order it from amazon.com and it wouldn’t ship to my address.
          thanks

          Reply
  19. Clare

    Janie: would you consider doing a post advising Canadian and international patients on how to switch to another brand of NDT? There is a lot of info about the different options, but, particularly for Canadians, what’s missing is information on how to speak to our dr’s on making the switch to either compounded or a US brand (like WP of Naturethroid, for example). I’m seeing a lot of people on Facebook etc. that have done this, but it would be helpful to have the info on how to request it from your doctor and explain that Erfa is not the only option.

    Reply
    • Sandra

      Hi Cynthia,
      You say people are ordering other thyroid hormone’s into Canada, are you able to copy and post that information here in case Janie maybe too busy to do that for those of us who may need this sooner than later?
      It would help greatly.

      Reply
  20. Anne

    It seems they only tested the concentration of all the batches which people complained about, instead of what was actually in them. The problem can’t have been the concentration, because if it were then every person taking ERFA would have complained. The problem must be in the fillers or else due to some sort of contamination. I think this is most likely because many of us had immediate allergic-type reactions to it. It could also be something to do with the new compression machines altering the chemical content by their heat, but that doesn’t explain those of us having problems with the ‘old’ batches made in Belgium. Also I’ve read one post where someone has an even newer batch with an expiry of 2017 and they are fine, so it could possibly be a fault in all batches made between certain dates. A cynic might think that when the first reports started emerging about problems, the facility began a new run with completely new ingredients.

    Reply
    • Darla

      Janie..I live in Ontario.Canada and have read your book a couple of times now and this is what set me in motion to switch to a dessicated thyroid. After being on levo/synthroid and combo of Cytomel for 20 years at .150mg i have struggled with feeling “normal/ human”. I had been diagnosed with Graves disease when I was 19 and was treated twice with Radioactive Iodine, now in my early forties I wanted to take a stand and feel normal again. I decided to switch doctors after my family doctor was against prescribing a natural thyroid and consulted a naturopath doctor in February. This is how it has played out thus far….my NP doctor diagnosed me with adrenal gland fatigue and put me on Adrenplus 300 which is suppose to help the fatigued adrenals. He could not prescribed dessicated thyroid as Health Canada does not permit him to as of yet…he indicated to me that it was soon to be approved. So onto the next step I located a doctor in London, Ontario which I inquired if he treated adrenal and thyroid problems, which was confirmed he did. At my initial visit, he indicated to me that he really doesn’t believe in adrenal fatigue…and so he switched me to ERFA 60 mg. So 3 months later ..now I am in a real mess..here are my tests result as of May 25/14 TSH:15, T4:7, T3:2.1. Two weeks ago I went for my follow-up and he said to increase by 30 mg and then another 30 mg after a while if I still feel awful..no problem until I read about the Erfa mess. I increased by 30 mg and now am having symptoms of Graves disease again…fast heart rate, weak…dizzy…can’t sleep…So, back I went today to see him …this is what he told me to do…go back down to 60 mg! I was shocked and in disbelief that he thought it would work to put me back down to what I was on with such awful tests results and feeling..so tired. I said to him, do you not believe that there could be a problem with my adrenals causing this reaction to the increase of dessicated thyroid. An absolute NO! He said its simple…you felt better on less or I can switch you back to a synthetic t4, t3 combo syn/cyto and to which I indicated i have tried that. He said well you have to decide not me …I left and will not be returning. So now what? I guess I will have to go back on synthroid – which I sure don’t want to do., but until I can find another doctor who is taking new patients and can actually help! If any one reading is from Ontario an has a good doctor I hope you can help….I am once again at my WITTS END!!

      Reply
      • Sandra

        Janie,
        In the midst of my anger when I posted last, I forgot to say thank you for your well written reply to Dr. Knafo. Thank you for being our voice. I am eternally grateful to you and for your life saving (once again) blog.
        I am still at a loss about what is available to those of us in Canada as an alternative besides compounding. Is there a list that I can reference?
        thank you
        thank you

        Reply
      • Sandra

        Hi Darla,
        I feel for what you are experiencing. There are a couple of people that you can see, Dr Natasha Turner in Toronto and Dr Cara Flamer are two people. I did see both of them at one time for a short period but they were not covered by OHIP and I could not afford it. Also there is a list of doctors somewhere here on STTM that you can try. Also try calling your local compounding pharmacy and ask for a name of doctors that prescribe NTH and or cortef. It sounds like you need adrenal support in order to proceed and is why NTH is not working for you. Don’t give up and sorry I am not of much more help. I would offer you my MD but he said I cannot refer thyroid patients to him, just wants to treat menopausal men and women!

        Reply
        • Heather

          Sandra, I’m almost at menopause and live in Toronto, could you give me the name of that doctor??

          Reply
          • Sandra

            Hi Heather,
            I apologize for not replying as I haven’t checked back on all my comments until recently.
            His name is Dr. Gibb and he is located in Oshawa. He is an MD and charges $150.00 for the year and then charges your 20 minute appt to OHIP.
            Good luck!

        • Darla

          Sandra…thank you..I have found a doctor in Oakville, ON..appointment not until August 20th…will let you know. She does believe in adrenal fatigue as she herself has experienced it. May be light at the end of the tunnel.

          Reply
          • Sandra

            Hi Darla,
            That is fantastic!
            Would you be able to email me the name of the doctor you will see in August.
            I want to keep my doctor options open as I don’t know when my doctor plans on retiring.
            thanks and good luck, would love to hear how you make out.

    • waveylines

      Personally I think the clue is when he said they had a three fold increase in demmand for Thyroid ……that’s a huge rise to have to meet, which would not only involve increasing machinery to make it but sourcing increases with their suppliers, distributions, storage, packaging, staffing etc…..and still maintaiin a high quality product! Hmmm…..
      Thanks for the tips on alternatives Janie 🙂 🙂

      Reply
    • Dianne

      “Also I’ve read one post where someone has an even newer batch with an expiry of 2017 and they are fine, so it could possibly be a fault in all batches made between certain dates. A cynic might think that when the first reports started emerging about problems, the facility began a new run with completely new ingredients.”

      That’s interesting to hear Anne. I happen to be a cynic. : ) I might try to see if I can get a hold of a few 2017 tablets, and see how I react. I’ll know pretty quickly. I feel so terrible on new ERFA, though, that I’m actually scared to try it again.

      Reply
      • Anne

        Dianne I’m considering asking the pharmacy where I bought mine to substitute them for a new batch (expiry 2017) as soon as they have new stock. I know that the pharmacy, which is online, has promised that to another person. Either way I’ve spent the money on them and Dr Knafo’s statement means I can’t get a refund easily, but like you I’m now very wary of ERFA. Yesterday I began a slow switch to Thiroyd and am imagining all sorts of off effects today which are no doubt all in my mind!

        Reply
  21. Shanna

    I have been taking Erfa Thyroid since 2010..The new 2014 Erfa is making me sick. .I am not going to take Erfa until they correct the medication. I do not care how much “testing” is done. This does not change the fact that all my symptoms have returned and my free t3 and t4 have plummeted. My vitamin D and ferritin levels are perfect..I am interesting in seeing your “sales” for 2014 next year Dr. KNAFO. You would never admit to the public that such a vital mistake was made anyway. To disregard so many people’s health and well- being is beyond me.

    Reply
  22. karen

    good God…i just started on this yesterday after months of avoiding meds!! my pills are 30mg and don’t look like the grainy ones. they are easy to cut and not hard like the newer ones. they could be the better batch. i am experiencing diarrhea today…i assume from the erfa.
    please, do you guys think i should stop taking it and wait for better clarification? thanks for this website..its been so helpful. karen.

    Reply
  23. Dianne

    Maybe the only way we can really find out for sure what is in ‘new ERFA’ is to find an independent lab that has no direction/instruction from, or affiliation with, ERFA Canada. Does anyone have any ideas? Would Health Canada be able to test it, with no input from ERFA in any way? Or some other lab? It seems ERFA’s recent testing did not test the actual ingredients, just the concentration. Which is of no value to us in the least.

    Reply
  24. Clare

    Erfa has us by the throat and they know it. This problem will persist as long as they are allowed to corner the market. Perhaps we’re better off focusing our energies on someone who will listen and cares about their customers. How do we lobby RLC labs to open shop in Canada – so that we can get Naturethroid and WP. Do we all start sending them emails and start a social media campaign to get RLC’s attention?

    Reply
  25. Marian

    Janie, please could you ask Dr Knafo to certify that Erfa is still gluten free and that the new factory and new raw ingredients are guten-free certified with no possibility of contamination? I have celiac symptoms while on lot: LF03140A, EXP: 10/16. I observe a strict gluten-free diet and want to know if Erfa is safe in this regard. In order to be given the term ‘gluten-free’ manufacturers must observe certain rules. Erfa has up to now claimed gluten-free status.
    Rules on certification are here: http://www.celiaccentral.org/gluten-free-certification/

    Thanks for all your efforts on patients’ behalf.

    Reply
  26. Lorraine Gray

    is anyone saying the new ERFA is still working okay for them?

    Reply
  27. Laura

    I am SO glad I found this info. I was beginning to think I was nuts. I have been taking ERFA for years and just recently after getting my script refilled my weight began to creep up after being steady at 140 I have gained almost 10lbs in just a few months with no change in diet or exercise. I just looked at my tablets and they look like the new ones- shiny and hard. I have a bottle of older ones and compared- totally different. I think I will switch back to the older batch and contact my local compounding pharmacy to see if they carry Naturethroid. I went through the Armour debacle, am now dealing with trying to locate a good new thyroid Dr since my previous one literally disappeared with no patient notification. The new Dr I saw the other day seems to be narrow minded,only goes by numbers and doesn’t like natural thyroid. I have a feeling she will want to put me on synthroid. I also have an 89 yr old Mum with Graves without a thyroid so I have her to worry about as well.

    Reply
  28. Karen

    Janie:

    I checked my CBC reports from hospital, the hemoglobin and hematocrit and MCV are normal – there were no ranges posted. Appreciate your help.
    Karen

    Reply
  29. Thea

    Dianne, my thoughts exactly: “Maybe the only way we can really find out for sure what is in ‘new ERFA’ is to find an independent lab that has no direction/instruction from, or affiliation with, ERFA Canada”. Mike at Natural News does toxicity tests on food and perhaps other substances. If I had any of the new pills I’d send him some…

    Reply
  30. Karen

    Janie: Unfortunately those tests – serum iron, ferritin and TIBC – are not routinely done when you enter the ER at my hospital. I will have to ask my primary for those tests. Thank you for your information.

    Reply
  31. Karen

    To those of you who are switching to other desiccated: Have you looked into the inactive ingredients in some of them? I thought Westhroid P would be a good substitute for ERFA when it was unavailable in Dec-Jan , but I had allergic reactions to ints inactives. I have a list I will post later on inactives in desiccated.

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      The ingredients are all listed here: http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/armour-vs-other-brands And once you discover and treat either your low iron and/or cortisol issues, you may see what seems like allergic reactions go away!

      Reply
    • Dianne

      I just wish these thyroid pharmaceutical companies would produce an ndt medication that doesn’t have all these unnecessary ‘other ingredients’ in them. I don’t think colouring, products used in plastics and anti-freeze, titanium dioxide, CELLULOSE, and who-knows-what-else (to name a few), is needed! Most of us that need thyroid hormone replacement already have enough problems without ingesting… garbage. I believe ERFA had a high quality product that most of us could tolerate well, and then they went and changed the formula. And most likely because it’s cheaper to produce. At least those are my suspicions. Now look at the mess we’re in.

      Reply
  32. jobeth

    I feel that the erfa is contaminated.
    They wont admit to it.
    Too many of us ill.
    I am well again on nature – throid.
    No confidence in erfa to ever go back.
    Unreliable. Can’t be trusted.

    Reply
    • Lauren

      I agree, Jobeth. The company lacks integrity and respect for its consumers. Even if the “mystery” of the whole Erfa Thyroid debacle is solved, would we really want to put our faith (and money) into a company that so unethically and disrespectfully disregarded the people who keep them in business??? I. Think. Not. Bye bye Erfa.

      Reply
  33. Nick

    As a male, I thought that I’d better chip in before this situation is dismissed as female hysteria! lol

    I too have gone right down hill again this year, very similar to how I did when they changed Armour Thyroid. I thought that the reason imay have been a virus I had, but I should be well over that by now, and I am continuing to get worse.

    I am in the UK, and will now write to my NHS endo to tell him of the situation, and see if he will agree to try another NDT. It took me months to get him to switch me to ERFA from Armour, so I don’t hold out much help of getting help quickly.

    If these companies must change something (and why fix it if it ain’t broken?) then surely they should put out a small batch first to see how the customers react. I worry that this is another company that has been ‘got to’ as ‘they’ try to get us ALL on synthetic thyroid medication.

    Reply
  34. Nick

    I have now contacted ERFA with my concerns.

    I have also telephoned the pharmacy that supplies my ERFA, and they are going to find out if they can obtain Naturethroid. If they can, I will ask my (NHS) endo if I can try that instead of the ERFA.

    For those in the UK, the pharmacy (Lloyds) told me that they buy ERFA from Pharmarama. According to the Thyroid UK site, Pharmarama also sell Naturethroid. So in theory at least, it should be an easy switch if your doctor/endo agrees to change the prescription.

    Reply
    • waveylines

      Hi Nick,
      I live in the Uk too -and normally get my prescription of Erfa on the NHS ( which like you was a major achievement!) -my Lloyds pharamcist has told me they can get Naturethroid so you should be alright once you have convinced your endo….. I actually want to switch to WP Throid which is by the same company but made for those of us who are hypoallegenic ( sorry spelling) but Lloyds say they can’t get it for me -so am on the hunt for a stockist in the UK.
      Good luck Nick with the Endo…..I’ve got an appointment with my GP this Wed on the same mission…..not optomistic either! So already pruchased some off the net……not going down the levo route again ever!

      Reply
      • Nick

        Hi waveylines,

        I had a call back from the hospital pharmacy yesterday afternoon to ask me about the problem. They suggested that I give my endo a list of all the alternatives as any medication that is purchased by the hospital has to be approved by a committee as being safe, coming from an approved source etc. So the more options that they have, the more likely they are to get an approved alternative, although I suspect that Naturethroid is favourite.

        Good luck with your search for WP thyroid. I couldn’t find that one when I searched yesterday.

        I haven’t had hay fever since I went on NDT but this year it is very bad!

        Reply
        • waveylines

          Hi Nick,
          Thanks and you 🙂
          WP Thyroid is the new name for WesthroidP it is made by the same manufactureres as Naturethroid
          Lloyds Pharamcy can get it -their specialist team in London source and order in and then it is sent out to your local pharmacy. So eitheryou get it from the hospital or your endo needs to ask your GP to prescribe. However I have to warn you that just becuase an endo recommends doesn’t mean to say that the GP’s will oblige you with a prescription…..so be careful! Sorry you probably have found this out already…lol

          Reply
          • Nick

            I also discovered that WP is West-Throid, and it is supplied by the same people as Nature-Throid.

            I don’t get my NDT from my GP. He (and the local PCT) refused to supply it, so my very kind endo prescribes it instead. In a way that makes things a bit easier, but of course if he leaves, I am scuppered.

            I recently blagged a B12 injection off a new GP, and noticed that it relieved all the hypo symptoms. Because I only had a single shot, the effect was short-lived but I am now in a full-on battle to get regular B12 treatment, even though my serum levels are OK. But, as it took me 15 years to get NDT, I may well be relieved of ALL symptoms before I get the B12 shots. 😉

  35. Karen

    Hi Janie,

    Thanks for all you do on behalf of thyroid patients around the world.

    After reading your comments and those of others with respect to current Erfa problems, I wondered if there is any possibility that the problem is with the raw T3/T4 active ingredients supplied to the various manufacturers. The reason I ask is I switched to Naturethroid after the Armour disaster and after six months on it have had a return of higher TSH, hair falling out, fatigue, feeling freezing cold and low temperature, etc., with no change in my dose. Does anyone oversee the actual suppliers of the pig/ hog thyroid? Is it manufactured in the US?

    Thanks,
    Karen H.

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      Hi Karen, probably not, because there aren’t widespread complaints about any of the other NDT’s. Your issue with Naturethroid was because of what we’ve gone over a few times—you probably have low iron and/or a cortisol problem….:)

      Reply
  36. Nick

    I forgot to add that, in an act of desperation, I am now crushing the ERFA tabs with half a tab of B12, between two spoons and mixing the powder into 500 ml of fruit juice. I started yesterday and this morning I didn’t wake up feeling like I was in hell.

    Reply
    • Anne

      Nick this is an interesting way to take ERFA. Can you tell me what the lot number and expiry are of the tablets you’re doing this with. Also the B12 tablets please? I have lot humber 13C02 expiry 03/2016 which was made in the old factory in Belgium but I had an immediate stomach reaction to it and after three days became suddenly dizzy and light-headed. Not sure if I want to try them again but if your way of taking them works that would be good as I have a jar with 495 tablets left in it and only two weeks of the old tablets left 🙁

      Reply
      • Anne

        Correction my tablets are 13C06, and not good at all!

        Reply
        • waveylines

          Hi Anne,
          Mine are the same batch 13C06 2016 and I feel terrible on them. I was told, like you, they were from the old factory and everything is ‘fine’ Am signed off work by my GP as am too poorly to work -waiting for the WP Thyroid to come through -can’t wait! I was on Erfa Thyroid for over three years and did really well, felt great until the start of 2014…..been down hill ever since….

          Dr Knafo -why haven’t you replied to my last three emails? You told us to contact you if we had any concerns…..

          Reply
          • Anne

            Waveylines I told Dr Knafo that I had an immediate allergic-type response to those tablets and he replied by suggesting I had become allergic to something in them and should see my doctor. He didn’t seem to understand that this is impossibloe as I am not allergic to the other ERFA tablets that I have!

          • Dianne

            Anne, I also told Dr. Knafo about my allergic reactions to the new ERFA, and that I wasn’t allergic to the old stock. So more than just one person has complained about an allergic reaction! The ‘not-seeming-to-understand’ part is maddening and a little unbelievable.

          • Jerrod Penworth

            i got the 500 125mg erfa about two weeks ago, lot 13C06 2016,,, i ran out the end of may my body temps began to get real cool by the 10th of june 94.5f under the arm,,,when i got the new batch two weeks ago i began 3 grains a day,,, my body temps back up and everything is well notice no difference except they maybe a little stonger than my last 500 125mg bottle,,my pills do not look all speckled with colors they just slightly crunch and melt in your mouth very pleasent as always,, im very sensitive to change so maybe my batch was a good batch good luck folks

      • Nick

        Sorry for the delay in replying. My batch number is LF93507A (expiry 02/17). My previous batch was LF03072A (10/16).

        I noticed no difference from crushing the tablets but have upped my dose from 4×30 mg per day to 6×30 and do feel slightly better. I’m suffering with a bit of hay fever at present so hard to say if the increased dose has any negative effects. I am also taking them sublingually (they taste quite pleasant). And I take my B12 the same way at the same time as my morning dose so the two ‘go in’ together. I’ve no idea if this works well or not.

        BTW I used to suffer with hayfever prior to being put on Armour (when it worked). So the hayfever seems to be related to the hypo (which is Hashis). No doubt all tied up with the immune system.

        I’m beginning to wonder if they aren’t now making Armour and ERFA with synthetic T4/T3. Remember this all started with the FDA in the US wanting to bring Armour under its control! And we all know that the medical establishment promotes the idea that synthetic thyroid hormones work for everybody.

        Reply
        • Anne

          Thanks for telling me this Nick, also I see you’re going to try NatureThroid, that worked for me after Armour was reformulated but I didn’t get any more when it too was reformulated, I switched straight to ERFA. It would be good to know if you get on with it when you do get some! Are you the person who became ill after travelling in the far east years ago?
          It seems that lot numbers BN136051 60 mgs expiry 07/2016, and LF03140B 60 mgs expiry 10/2016 are both ok. If so this adds to the confusion. Some batches ok, some not, some from the old factory in Belgium (mine) some from the new factory in Spain, some look the same as usual some look different, some people are saying the same batches are ok when packaged in 100s but not in 500s, it doesn’t make much sense!

          Reply
          • Nick

            Yes, I got much more ill (I’ve never been properly well) after a back-packing trip around the world between 1979 and 1981. That’s now on You Tube if you are interested.

            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nF5rnkhN668&list=PL5d11JwmawKG0chMuuHe7azRdLHSgQVte

          • Anne

            Nick – I can’t reply to you direct for some reason so I do hope you see this – thank you for the link to your YouTube videos of your trip around the world – I’ve watched the first one and have bookmarked them all to watch over the weekend. I’ve also linked on my Facebook page because I’m sure my friends will enjoy them too!

        • Nick

          Hi Anne, yes I saw your post. I hope you enjoy the video clips (from happier days when my life didn’t revolve around thyroid medication lol)

          Reply
    • Sandra

      Hi Nick,
      Are you still feeling well taking your pills that way?
      I am going to try it that way tomorrow.

      Reply
      • Nick

        I’m now simply placing the tablets under my tongue until they dissolve. On the morning dose I also take my sublingual B12 at the same time.

        Sorry to say I am still feeling very hypo!

        Reply
        • Sandra

          I am so sorry to hear that Nick, so don’t you think crushing them may help, I didn’t crush mine today but will try that tomorrow.

          Reply
          • Nick

            I can’t see that crushing them would do anything different to having them simply dissolve under the tongue.

  37. bean

    I was on the old Armour when it all changed- horrible- so went on Nature-throid, same thing happened with that company!! So is Nature-throid OK now??!!
    Then because of it all- i went on Erfa a few years back. This week I called my pharmacy to refill (recommended by this site- universal drug store)- and they said NO Erfa available- and hasn’t been for a month. I came online to research, and found these comments on Erfa. I wonder if this is why they can’t refill my Rx ?
    I “thought” i was doing OK on Erfa, until a thought back a few months to beginning of 2014 and remembered (maybe Feb ?) of horrible symptoms- extreme muscle pain and fatigue, and just thought it was the time of the year changing. I sonde if IT WAS Erfa??!! It lasted awhile and was so bad i thought i would loose my job.
    So after Universal Drug could not refill my RX, I contacted Erfa.
    heres what they said
    “it is now available” end of message by Simon Soucy (president Erfa).

    So then I wrote back asking due to what I’ve read have they changed anything with Erfa. Here is their response:
    “No ,
    Thyroid is the same product since it introduction 25 years ago.
    There is no change in the formulation. I invite you to communicate this to
    whoever said this.

    Regards

    Simon Soucy
    President
    Erfa Canada 2012 Inc. ”

    wow- very blunt and to the point.
    great- now as a patient who does not have the energy to figure this all out- I have to or bear the miserable results.

    hope this is information to anyone seeking it

    Reply
    • Anne

      I think the reply you received confirms that they don’t really care and wish we’d all go away!

      Reply
      • Sandra

        Well we ARE going to go away, find other options aren’t we!

        Reply
    • Paul

      Hi Delann, similar symptom here too
      June 1st, ended and old batch of Thyroid and Started on a new one (Lot: LF03505A, Exp: 02/2017)
      Blood work on June 3rd, Back to hypo. TSH:1.4, T4L:11.3 (normal 12-22) T3L: 1.9 (Normal 1.3-3.1) TPO-ab: 29 (Normal 0-35)
      June 4- 5 very bad headeakes, June 6-7-8-9 , Terrible headeackes + plus pain all over the body, ackes muscles, could not speep, too painfull, restless legs, had to take tylenol with codeine to ease the pain. No energy at all, very tired.,depress.
      Used to have migraine for many years and be hospitalise at some occasion. Found out that I had milk intollerance, stop all milk product since august 2013 and no headakce since. except this episode with Erfa Thyroid, really make me wonder about the product contaminated???
      During that episode, I found this site and all this blog on Erfa. I then stard shopping around to differents neigborghoud pharmacies to find and old bottle of Thyroid that I fimally found and start taking it on June 14, That’s a week ago, since, no more headeackes, no more pain, felling better, no more depress, was able to mow the grass, do bike, the sun is back again
      From what I read, from the symptom occurings at the same time that I took this new bach or Erfa, 2+2=4 , There seems defenitely something wrong
      Thanks Janie ,you are doing a terrific job at hepling and informing people
      Paul, Montreal

      Reply
  38. Delann

    I have my doubts as others do about the results from the independent lab that nothing was shown to be wrong with the erfa thyroid pills since changing manufacturing facilities. Why didn’t Dr. Knafo post the results from his “independent Re-testing”? Unless I missed it, I suggest he do that. He knows of this site.

    I can only sit here and wonder why did a proven thyroid treatment that finally gave me back my life, suddenly with Quote “no change” start making my hypo symptoms return? The repercussions of admitting something did indeed go wrong would create turmoil within that company with perhaps numerous law suits, the returns of batches in question, the refunds in monies. Can you imagine the demands to make good on the bad batches in question and especially with what? 300 “new” customers?

    Companies that think they can play with thyroid medication as though it was a vitamin or some general across the board supplement are missing the intelligence boat when it comes to people like me who have NO thyroid gland and have to rely on replacement med to live. We hypothyroid people of all people know when there is a “change” in something. The thyroid hormone is so vital to life that if it gets “off” in the smallest of ways, we detect it.

    How can Dr. Knafo dismiss so many reporting ill effects and in the same breath say nothing has changed? Is he trying to send the message that over 170 posts of such that it is all in our heads? Or, we have all of a sudden “changed” something in our lifestyles or diets? Get real. I know I haven’t “changed” anything in my routine.

    I don’t know what internal disruption may have taken place within the Erfa Company for it to have “changed” its manufacturing plant in the first place, or what could possibly motivate them to “blame” the patient instead of a through investigation based upon the uproar of patients complaints reporting. I don’t know if contaminations, sub standard ingredients, changes in additives/fillers, unskilled help in the new facility, transport heat and cold regulations were met or what everrrrrrrrr has happened. However, I guess erfa underestimated this time by NOT doing a COMPLETE investigation into EVERY avenue of the manufacturing plant and production of thyroid medication as a concerned company should do and reporting that results, because they now see that many are dropping erfa for other thyroid treatment meds.

    Dr Knafo may state that the “retesting” showed no change in the concentrations of t4/t3, However, It is what he is NOT saying that is detrimental! I truly believe they are hiding something. I agree a hundred percent with what Janie said that this is all HOG WASH! I no longer trust Erfa Company and will never recommend it to anyone else again like I did in previous years nor will I use this product Erfa Thyroid again!

    Reply
    • Dianne

      Delann, You took the words right out of my mouth. I agree with everything you’ve just said and couldn’t have said it any better.

      Reply
    • Lauren

      I agree Delann!

      Reply
  39. Sandra

    Is there a way to get the formulation of what was in the “good” Erfa including what filler, amount of T3 and T4 and other ingredients for me so I can tell my pharmacy what to do to create my compounded natural thyroid formula?
    thank you

    Reply
  40. Dianne

    re: the test results people would like to see: I emailed Dr. Knafo today (June 18, 2014) asking if I could see the results of the test. Dr. Knafo told me that the tests are confidential and seen only by Health Authorities (Health Canada), and that they are available in their office only, also saying that ‘(we don’t let it out)’. I’m not sure if this means if someone is able to travel to Montreal to Dr. Knafo’s office, whether they can view the results there, though.

    Reply
    • Angie

      Interesting…Knafo offered for us to see the tests earlier. I have requested also and I have requested to learn what tests were actually done. I have had no response as yet. To give Dr. Knafo credit, he usually does respond albeit slowly.

      Reply
  41. Darla

    Here’s a thought…should we all not report side effects to Health Canada..to launch a further investigation? Online:www.health.gc.ca/medeffect.

    Reply
    • Samirah

      That’s a good idea, but I’d hold off on that until we see if the new pills are ok. If Health Canada gets involved they could shut Erfa down completely. I have a friend who works with insurance\drug companies, and she said if they get complaints about a drug, Health Canada shuts them right down… I don’t know all the details about all that… but if the new pills are ok, we definitely down want to loose the only NDT here in Canada.

      Reply
      • Angie

        I’d like to hear from those with later expiration date batches..I’m willing to order one and try it, but if I have similar problems, then I absolutely will complain to Health Canada. If ERFA is not going to launch a serious investigation into this and provide us with full disclosure of same, then quite frankly they NEED to be shut down. I was so ill on the new med I thought I was dying and I assure you my doctor, knowing that I am not given to histrionics, took that quite seriously.

        Reply
        • Dianne

          Angie, that’s a good point. If ERFA has no problem putting out what some of us feel is a contaminated product to the public, then maybe they should be reported to Health Canada, and let the chips fall where they may. Like you, some of us have reported we felt like we were dying on it, but we do fine on old ERFA; and ERFA maintains an attitude that it’s something wrong on our part.

          Reply
          • Nick

            Pharmarama in the UK have a batch of 30mg x 500 EFRA Thyroid dated exp 2017, lot # LF03508A but tell me that they will not send any out until earlier stocks are exhausted.
            I asked if the person that I spoke to could give me an idea of the appearance of these tablets but they are not allowed to open the containers.
            I don’t know how many UK ERFA users get their supply through Phramarama but it could be quite a while before that batch reaches me! 🙁

        • Lori T

          Angie I am one with a newer batch of 30mg x 500 EFRA Thyroid dated exp 2017, lot # LF03508A and am doing fine on them. They seem to be the old version, no shininess, no spots, no hardness, no deep indentations and no bad side effects.

          I read earlier that Paul has a batch (Lot: LF03505A, Exp: 02/2017) that is causing him problems. I’m not sure if his are 30mg, but they are one tiny number off in the lot number.

          Reply
          • Nick

            Very interesting Lori. I have a batch of the LF03507A that do not appear to be working (and also resemble the shinier new look). So have ERFA changed back I wonder? It would be the answer to all our prayers!

          • Angie

            Hi Lori T:
            What is your specific exp date besides the year (ERFA usually provides the month as well). Thanks for weighing in!
            A.

          • Lori T

            Angie, sorry I should have put the month also, it is 02/2017

          • Sandra

            Hi Lori,
            I was wondering if you are still doing well on this batch? I just started it today and would love to hear good news. I am starting a staycation next week and although not the big picture would love to feel well enough to enjoy it.
            thanks!

  42. Janie Bowthorpe

    FROM JANIE: I heard from Dr. Knafo this morning, and out of respect to him, I’m not going to print his entire email. But what I will state is that he continues to state that “there was no change in formulation or method of manufacturing. All the reports revealed that the medication is within normal specs.” You can also read between the lines of what he might have said by my response below:

    Dr. Knafo,

    Thank you for responding. I do believe you that you feel nothing was changed.

    But your belief doesn’t take away that there are a growing body of patients who were doing very well….then when they started taking the “new” Erfa Thyroid, their symptoms came back. That is very telling, Dr. Knafo, that something has, in fact, changed….even if you believe nothing has.

    No, this is not about your medication “not fitting all patients”. This is about patients who did, in fact, fit with Erfa Thyroid and were doing wonderful on it, only to see their symptoms come back when they started on their new bottles with the new Erfa Thyroid.

    I work diligently to first examine and evaluate what I hear from patients before coming to any conclusion or even reporting on what I hear. That has been my method for over a decade with anything related to Stop the Thyroid Madness (STTM). I have done the same with these patient reports about Erfa Thyroid. I hesitated. I listened. I examined. And it became clear to me that yes, something has changed. You simply cannot discount this many people who did wonderful, ONLY until they started on their “new” Erfa and saw their hypothyroidism return.

    It grieves me that you seem to be discounting what’s going on across the board as to what is clearly going on. And if you are reading the heartfelt responses on my blog post, you are grieving many other sincere people, as well. That won’t bode well for Erfa Canada. 🙁

    Sincerely,
    Janie Bowthorpe, M.Ed.

    Reply
    • Cynthia

      How can he continue to say there was no change in the “method of manufacturing” when we’ve been told the “compression” of the tablet is different due to different equipment? I worked in manufacturing facilities long enough to understand that IS A CHANGE in the manufacturing process. So that lie needs to stop.

      As for no “change in the formulation”, ok Dr. Knafo, I can believe you on that. The ingredients may be the same – BUT WERE THEY EXAMINED/ANALYZED for contaminants? For example, in my email to Dr. Knafo (in May which he never answered) I questioned whether there could have been “cross-contamination” with medications that contain gluten. If the new Spain manufacturing facility processes medications with gluten, the equipment must be totally santitized/etc. before processing any medications claiming not to contain gluten – or does ERFA not claim that???

      We will never get the truth on this though…and Dr. Knafo’s conscience is his problem…my problem is the decline in health I got while on BAD ERFA…which lost them a loyal customer.
      Anyone know where I can get a couple hundred dollars refund due to BAD ERFA? 🙁

      Reply
    • Angie

      Janie..I continue to ask the same questions as in my earlier post. What testing was done? Dr. Knafo has offered to show us the results, but when asked for them he has not responded (at least to my email anyway). ERFA fit me just fine from 2009 to 2014. Life changing like no other. And it is suddenly no longer a fit???? Interestingly enough, when I switched back to older ERFA or N-T, the symptoms I had dissipated. This is not a pt issue. I am not interested in a lawsuit. I am interested in getting my old ERFA back. It sounds as if Knafo and ERFA are going to discount those that have had problems. I have seen a couple of posts that indicate that batches with exp dates of 2017 and after are okay. Janie, can you confirm? I do just okay on Nature-throid, don’t seem to absorb WP at all, have not tried Thyro-Gold and great on the OLD ERFA. In addition, the Nature-throid causes a return of acute diverticulitis eventually, which is no fun at all. Unsure as to why..Please help, Janie and thanks in advance for your help.

      Reply
      • Janie Bowthorpe

        Angie, it’s too soon for me to report that batches with an expiration of 2017 are working. As someone attempting to help thyroid patients, I feel a strong responsibility to listen to a lot more reports before mentioning that something is gospel. But I’ll keep listening and report if something looks like a strong possibility.

        Reply
        • waveylines

          I am getting confused by the dates for Erfa thyroid batches. When I was sourcing the thyroid med brand I wanted to switch too I spoke to pharmacists at central supplies in the Uk. On of them told me that Erfa Thyroid has changed its formula from 2017 batches onwards…..now I am sorry I was so shocked I didn’t get that person’s name. This pharmacist was very clear about the testing -He said well testing the active ingredients in a thyroid tablet is not going to really help -what you need to know is the fillers and how they interact with the active thyroid meds and the degree they aid or inhibit uptake. So I am interested that Dr Knafo has confirmed that testing for the ratio of t4 to t3 is the same but not commented on the interaction between this and the fillers. Why?
          Dr Knafo has still not replied to my last three emails or even read them by the looks of it. I don’t understand, I was a happy patient who was on Erfa doing really well for over three years…..and then something happened in 2014 -and boom crash wallop my health has collapsed and you wont reply? I have no other medical conditions beyond Hypothyroidism…..my doctor has checked! Suddenly Erfa is not a fit for me? -well yes that is true now but not because I have changed Dr Knafo!!

          Reply
          • Angie

            Wavey: We believe the formula was changed OR there was a problem with early 2014 manufactured batches. Not 2017. I disagree, coming from a laboratory testing environment that testing of active ingredients is inconsequential. In fact, changes in proportion or amount of trace active ingredients (calcitonin, T1 and T2) may very well be some of what we all were experiencing as WELL as a thorough investigation as to possible contaminants. Give Dr. Knafo some time. He usually does respond, but can be a little slow.

        • Angie

          Janie: I may volunteer to be a guinea pig. I read that at least one (maybe two or three) had done better on batches/lots with later expiration dates (e.g., 2017). I’ll know pretty quickly if the same issues persist. May take two-three weeks as I receive meds somewhat slowly. Stay tuned and thanks for your help.

          Reply
          • Angie

            Well, attempted to get a 2017 exp date or after from Canada Drug. These people confound me. Every single time I place an order, it takes several phone calls and/or emails to get the order completed and sent on its way. Today was told by someone (I’ve been an educated thyroid pt since 1996) at Canada Drug that they were going to fill my script with Armour (presumably the new since the old isn’t available) since the old Armour and ERFA were the same medication (they actually are not..slight T4/T3 ratio difference). Saw other posts that stated that 30 and 60 mg were not in stock..could this be ERFA starting from scratch and fixing their problem? One can only hope…stay tuned!

          • Angie

            Was just told by Canada Drug that they had no ERFA with an exp date of later than 10/2015…have asked them some pointed questions..where are you all getting the late 2017 exp date batches?

        • Angie

          One other point, however…has Knafo responded to you with regard to testing that was done and actual results?

          Reply
          • waveylines

            Angie,
            I fully appreciate that Dr Knafo is a very busy man -but what i find strange is that he replied to my first emails giving him the info but has not read the last two emails -as i ask for a read receipt. He has in the past responded quickly……not now… My emails are polite and respectful and were sent nearly two weeks ago..

  43. Tammy

    I’m just now hearing about the Erfa Thyroid change. I have been taking it since the Armour reformulation with good results. I still have enough to last until beginning of next year. I have not had any problems with what I have on hand right now. None of my bottles have lot numbers or expirations dates on them. I have been getting my refills from Universal Drugstore. I just got another script from my doctor & glad I have not filled it yet. Don’t need 500 pills of crap that don’t work. I hope there is a solution to the problem before I need a refill. Is the Armour back to where you can take it sublingually or is it still like it was when they made the change? You could not take it sublingually any longer on the last refill I had. If Erfa does not solve the problem I will have to switch but have not idea if I should switch back to Armour or something else. I finally signed up for STTM emails so I’m looking forward to an email saying Erfa has solved the problem. What else is everyone taking since this change has occurred? Don’t these companies know if it ain’t broke don’t fix it.

    Reply
  44. Mirjam

    Hi, first of all, thank you for the blog! I write from Finland. I have been on Thyroid many years after changing from Armour because there was some changes in composition of Armour. In May I started 13G051 exp. 07 2015. I immediately noticed that tablets were extremely hard, and in one or two week I was again extremely tired. I was wondering what was happening and I also wrote email to this Dr. Knafo. He informed me that they have not changed the composition of Thyroid. Thanks to your blog I found out that also other patients have had problems with these new Thyroid tablets. Also some other Finnish patients has had problems with these new tablets. I am tired with these thyroid problems and problems with medications. Also in Finland it is very very difficult to get help from doctors because here in Finland only official medications is called Thyroxin. Also here we have only Armour or Thyroid, not anything else.

    Reply
    • Marjaana

      Terve, hello Mirjam. I have same lot 13G051 exp 07/2016 (you have exp 2015, it’s 2016?) and these don’t work. My friend have
      lot LF03139B EXP10/2016 and it doesnt work eighter. These pills are 60 mg/500 pcs. This is so f***xx frustrating!

      Reply
  45. Mirjam

    Correction to my earlier post: The new Thyroid was 13G051 exp. 07 2016.

    Reply
  46. Christine

    Where can I buy good Armour online? Please email me and let me know. selam@nym.hush.com Doctors do not prescribe enough to take away my symptoms.

    Reply
  47. waveylines

    This is from Dr Lowe in the USA -thought it might be of interest -please note what he says for re-occurance of symptoms on medication, Hopefully Dr Knafo will see this:-
    http://web.archive.org/web/20101030194420/http://drlowe.com/QandA/askdrlowe/t4therapy.htm

    “If you’re new to the use of thyroid hormone, and you’re up to a dose that should be working for you, but you’re not benefiting from it, be sure to let your doctor and your pharmacist know. The dosage range that’s safe and effective for most patients is between 2-to-4 grains (120-to-240 mg) of desiccated thyroid. The equivalent dosage range for T4 is 200-to-400 mcg (0.2-to-0.4 mg). If you’re not improving within this dosage range, you may have thyroid hormone resistance, or the potency of the tablets or capsules you’re using may be lower than what’s stated on the label.
    If your thyroid hormone product was prescribed, the bottle containing the pills or capsules will have a batch number. Your pharmacist will probably replace your thyroid hormone tablets or capsules with others from another batch. If you’re using an over-the-counter product such as Nutri-Meds desiccated thyroid, the bottle won’t have a batch number, but you can ask the company to replace the capsules or tablets your currently using.
    If thyroid hormone has effectively relieved your hypothyroid or thyroid hormone resistance symptoms, but some of your symptoms have reappeared, you should consider whether the capsules or tablets your presently using have a lower-than-stated potency. You should let your doctor and pharmacist know the symptoms that have recurred. It will also help to have objective evidence, such as a decreased basal body temperature. Your doctor may find that your Achilles reflex that had become normal with thyroid hormone therapy has become slow again. And you may find that your basal temperature is decreased. If your TSH level was within the reference range, it may now be much higher now. Also, if your free T3 level was within the reference range, it may be much lower now”

    Reply
    • Dianne

      Not to mention that if you feel like a sledge hammer hit you over the head after taking one tablet, then that means something is wrong with the medication!

      Reply
      • Angie

        Dianne..I enjoyed your post. Just want to point out that my levels of T3 and T4 were fine on the “new” ERFA. I have seen posts from others where that was not the case. However, something was wrong. Of course, T1 and T2 nor calcitonin was measured. Nor did I do any toxicity panels. I had a severe fatigue, a heavy chest feeling, and felt so badly, as I told my primary, I would not have been surprised for him to tell me to put my affairs in order. Interestingly enough, though levels were good (even a little higher than I like them to be), I had no tendon reflex even with the hand-grasping maneuver…hmmmmm…

        Reply
  48. Nick

    Reading all the latest posts on this subject, it appears that the latest batches of ERFA COULD be OK. I’ve got a batch LF03507A (02/17) but am not yet feeling as well as I did in January/February. BUT, given that many of us may have been taking ERFA that doesn’t work, for months now, I wonder how soon we could actually expect to feel any improvement if these latest batches are OK.

    I hope that everybody will continue to report back here in order that we can get a clear picture of what is actually happening with ERFA. As we all no, other factors can affect us, so knowing how others are getting along with the same medication is very useful.

    Reply
  49. Sandra

    Hi,
    I have gone down hill since starting a 60 mg batch lot LF03139A exp 10 2016 and they are the shiny pills. I called my pharmacy to see if they have any both 30 or 60 pills expiry 2017 to see if it is a better batch and they have a batch that are from 2017 but are shiny but she said that both the 60’s and the 30’s are on back order!!!
    So not only do we have to worry about the formula but we have to worry about getting our prescriptions filled too!

    Reply
    • Angie

      Sandra: I have a 30 mg batch exp 10/2016. Did not do well on them. Very interesting that the meds are back ordered with manufacturing replenishing maneuvers early 2014. Wonder if there was a problem and ERFA is maybe starting from scratch? See my “guinea pig” posts and followups to Janie.

      Reply
  50. Sandra

    Hi,
    Late this afternoon, by some miracle was able to get an appt today by someone elses cancellation with my doctor to tell him that since I started my newest batch about a week ago have been seriously hypo. Before I went I called another pharmacy to find out that they had a batch of 30 mg LF03508A expirty 2017 and decided to get three days worth as I’d already spent money on 280 60 mg pills and didn’t want to waste money if this batch didn’t work. I sent my husband to go get them for me and drive me to my appointment as I was sheer exhausted from doing nothing on my day off and ovewhelmed by the thought of the 45 minute drive. I took the new pills before I left and
    shortly after my appointment I started to feel my exhaustion lift, my depression disappeared and my mood and energy completely change!! I also crushed the pills between two spoons and put it under my tongue.
    I am not going to jump the gun until I see how I do tomorrow when I go to work but will definitely report back.
    If it is working then I plan to get as much of those 30 mg pills before they run out. Back up plan is that my doctor has given me a prescription for compounded thyroid and if I need to will use it even though it is more than I can afford to pay but it is either that or back to thinking of quitting my job, which is not an option financially.
    Janie, my doctor also gave you high praises for your wonderful website being the greatest compilation of useful thyroid information out there on the internet!!! Thank you again!

    Reply
  51. Sandra

    Today is a different day, I’m home from work, too exhausted after a night of sleep. I then realized today that I did not take enough of the 30 mg pills to equal the dose I was taking in 60 mg pills and was ended up taking 30 mg less. It could be the reason I don’t feel good today but in my anxiousness decided to get the compounded prescription filled with clear instructions of what I want them to use and the amounts based on the information Janie has provided to us under thyroid treatments. The pharmacist told me he can only fill it with synthetic T3 and T4 and it would cost $200.00 for 120 pills. I said I didn’t want synthetic and would like to fill only a weeks worth of compounded. He said that he could not fill a small amount as he as to source and order in a certain amount and if I didn’t want a full prescription then he would be stuck with it, (which I understood). He also said it would be more expensive than the synthetic.
    So is synthetic the issue or is the T4 only the issue but a T4/T3 combo possibly ok?

    Reply
    • Angie

      Sandra: Your lot # is the same as Lori’s that she reports she is doing okay on. You may want to give it a little time.

      Reply
      • Sandra

        Hi Angie,
        Thanks for telling me this and noticing that. You are too kind.I am going to get as many of them as I can now, I know it could be wasted money if they don’t work but if they do then it will be a blessing. So Lori wrote on the comments here that she was doing ok on batch LF03508A 2017 expiry?
        thanks

        w

        Reply
        • Angie

          Sandra..Lori wrote, some days ago, that the batch # in question she was doing okay on. If you scroll back in the comments on this blog, you will find her post. The best way to find out if she has continued to do well is to ask her directly.

          Reply
        • Lori T

          Sandra I am still doing fine on them, no change whatsoever from my previous pills. 🙂

          Reply
          • Sandra

            That is great news! I seem to be doing ok on them too, fingers and toes crossed. Thanks for your reply Lori.

  52. Sandra

    Does any know or has anyone been able to find out if we can order Thiroyd or thyroid-s by Greater Pharma Manufacturing into Canada?
    thank you

    Reply
  53. Marilyn Borley

    I have just come on here to do a little research for myself and discovered that I am not alone. wow! I also just came back from seeing my doctor today who is sending me for blood tests tomorrow. My depression and hypo symptoms have returned. I have been on natural thyroid now for 4 years. A while back I got my prescription filled and I noticed right away that the pills had changed. I came on the internet to try and find out if Erfa had changed any of the ingredients as I have severe allergies. I could not find any information at all…none. I couldn’t even find an English web sight. So by reading on here I see that there is a severe problem with this company. I am appalled at their secrecy and lies. We know that they have changed it up on us! We know Erfa!! Not sure what it is we can do about this. I feel sick about it. Here I am having to get more testing done when it all has to do with Erfa. Wait till I tell my doctor!

    Reply
    • Angie

      Marilyn: Please make sure you report lot # and problems to Dr. Henri Knafo at ERFA Canada…

      Reply
      • Marilyn Borley

        HI Angie,
        Please let me know how I can get in touch with Dr. Henri Knafo at Erfa, do you have an e-mail address for him? (Maybe it’s on here and I missed it) I don’t know where to get the lot # from as there isn’t one on my prescription bottle?

        Reply
        • Angie

          The email address is given early in the blog. Please let me know if you don’t find it and I’ll retrieve from my email [direct] correspondence with him.

          Reply
  54. Trisha

    Hi Y’all,
    I appreciate everyone’s feedback & concern. I suffered greatly from the Armour reformulation fiasco, having to
    navigate my way… very costly!!! Thus,
    this is very disturbing.
    I finally got back on ERFA six months
    ago & am now building my ferriten level,
    & had just begin to make a turnaround!
    However, I now only have less than five days of ERFA left & am using a reserve of Armour which I don’t want to do! My dilemma is whether or not to chance reordering some ERFA or not? I don’t have the finds at present to see a private
    physician to request a Rx for Westhroid-P or Acella NP. If I get a good ERFA batch I’m set for a year!
    Has ANYONE out there tried either of these two ERFA lot numbers: ERFA 125 mg tabs, 500 Tabs, Lot #: 12H021 EXP. 8-31-2015. OR Lot #: 13C06 EXP. 3-31-2016.
    I would LOVE to have any feedback
    re: these above; good or bad? * especially if your experience was indisputably notable given a prior
    experience of excellent ERFA – such that comparatively, there is no doubt!
    Thank you & sincere thanks!!

    Reply
    • Anne

      Hi Trisha,
      Several of us have had problems with the 125mgs 13C06 expiry 03/2016. Mine were in a jar of 500, we’ve all got them from different pharmacies in different countries. According to Dr Knafo that lot number was manufactured in the old plant in Belgium not the new one in Spain, and he says there is nothing at all wrong with them, nevertheless I had an immediate allergic-type reaction to them which I have never had to ERFA in the past and I have been taking it since 2011. He then suggested I had become allergic to something in ERFA, but when I went back to an older jar I was fine again. I have now made a gradual switch to Thyroid-S which seems good. I have no doubt at all that something is wrong with that lot number, it may be an ingredient or it may have been stored wrongly somewhere, which would explain why more people aren’t complaining about it.

      Reply
  55. Trisha

    Hi Y’all,
    I appreciate everyone’s feedback & concern. I suffered greatly from the Armour reformulation fiasco, having to
    navigate my way… very costly!!! Thus,
    this is very disturbing.
    I finally got back on ERFA six months
    ago & am now building my ferriten level,
    & had just begin to make my biggest turnaround in YEARS!!
    However, I now have less than five days of ERFA left & am using a reserve of Armour which I don’t want to do! My dilemma is whether or not to chance reordering some ERFA or not? I don’t have the funds at present to see a private physician to request a Rx for Westhroid-P or Acella NP. But IF I get
    a good ERFA batch – I’m set for a year!
    Has ANYONE out there tried either of these two ERFA lot numbers: ERFA 125 mg tabs, 500 Tabs, Lot #: 12H021 EXP. 8-31-2015. OR Lot #: 13C06 EXP. 3-31-2016.
    I would LOVE to have any feedback
    re: these above; good or bad? * Especially if your experience was indisputably notable given a prior
    experience of excellent ERFA – such that comparatively, there is no doubt!
    Thank you & sincere thanks!!

    Reply
  56. Sarah

    Today I have picked up a new batch of ERFA

    LF 03072A. Expires 10/16

    has anyone had this batch and had problems with them?

    Reply
  57. Angie

    I would like to know, from those that have ERFA expiration dates of 2017, from what pharmacy were they able to obtain same? I refuse to deal with The Canadian Pharmacy again and Canada Drugs states that they have no lots with expiration dates beyond 10/2016 (manufactured Dec 2013). I already have a batch with expiration dates of 10/2016 that was unsatisfactory.

    Reply
    • Sandra

      Hi Angie,
      I just bought the last of what they have 204 pills of 30 mg and the expiry was 2017. My pharmacy is Total Health Pharmacy on Davis Drive in Newmarket Ontario. I started them today and will see how I do over the next couple of days.
      I had a days worth of my old pills (no shine, no idea what lot or expiry they were from) and felt better by afternoon yesterday when I took them and not feeling to badly today.

      Reply
      • Angie

        Thanks, Sandra..do you have any idea if THP would ship to the US?

        Reply
        • Sandra

          They are a local pharmacy but you could always give them a try to see if they would mail to you. They would have to have ordered in a new batch of 30mg as I took the last of what they had so it’s a roll of the dice what they will get when the reorder right?
          I will be in the same boat not sure what I will get when I have to reorder.
          So far I am feeling better on them.

          Reply
      • Cynthia

        Keep us updated. I would really like to go back on desiccated. On cytomel now.

        Reply
    • Lori T

      Angie I bought mine online, it was from a company in the UK. I wasn’t sure if they’d ship to Canada successfully but it was okay. I’m not sure if they would let you know the expiry date before shipping ( I imagine they would though), I found out about the bad batches three days after I ordered them! I lucked out 🙂

      Reply
      • Kelly

        Lori did you buy them from IAS? That is who I usually order from. If so then I am ordering some today.

        Reply
  58. Trisha

    Angie, you stated that: “I already have a batch with expiration dates of 10/2016 that was unsatisfactory.”
    Can you tell us please what Dosage,
    Quantity of tablets in the bottle, & WHAT the Lot # was of that batch that you report as being instatisfactory?
    Thank you!

    Reply
    • Angie

      Trisha: I have 2 batches from that manufacturing timeframe. BOTH were unsatisfactory. Was unable to obtain lot #’s for one of the two..for all I know it could be the same batch or not. The 2nd was 30 mg tabs Lot LF03117A. Supposed to be sealed container..not sure that it was. Do not purchase anything from this lot. Within 2-3 days I am ill from trying to take it and I have tried it, under different circumstances, several times.

      Reply
      • Shirley

        Interesting Angie. This is the same lot number I just had filled and I have had to stop due to unreal heart palpations. As noted previously, I have switched brands and after 10 days on the new prescription my palpatations have almost disappeared. FYI

        Reply
        • Angie

          Hello again, Shirley: The 2 batches including the lot # that gave you (and me) problems caused me to feel very ill. I did have palps, which I don’t normally have, but felt hypo. My labs were fine, if even a little on the high side for me, but something was wrong. In addition, I felt a heavy chest feeling and a fatigue so profound I felt like I was seriously ill. I saw my primary care doc and I told him how badly I felt. He knows I am not given to histrionics. I will not take any ERFA from either of the two batches I received early this year again. I just rec’d a new batch with a lot # that others say they’ve done well on..We shall see. Watch my comments as I plan to keep everybody informed.

          Reply
          • Shirley

            Hi Angie. I too felt that I was seriously ill and I spent alot of time in bed due to the severe fatigue. I had many nights when I was concerned about going to sleep. Thinking that I might have the “big one” overnight. Had never felt that way before. Look forward to hearing how you do on the new batch.

          • Angie

            Hi Shirley: Early indications are that this batch feels a little more like I am used to. However, it does seem to be a little on the weak side..only on for the 3rd day now, so we shall see and I will definitely keep you posted!

  59. Angie

    Hi Lori…I would need to know the expiration date. I stopped Canada Drugs from shipping me a 10/2016 batch just in time.

    Reply
  60. Roberta

    I have been following the Erfa story with great interest, having been through the Armour debacle and been on Erfa ever since. My latest lots have been working for me, with verification by fT3 and fT4 labs. Lots are:
    60 mg lot 12J011 exp 10/2015
    30 mg lot 13C011 exp 03/2016

    I hope this info can help somebody.

    Reply
    • Angie

      Roberta:
      Thanks..these exp dates are likely from the old factory and okay. Manufacturing dates and expiration respectively from the new factory (and problematic lots) appear to start with Dec/Jan 2014 and exp around 10/2016.

      Reply
  61. janella brown

    After all the recent problems with Erfa I will now be looking a buying a different NDT and am considering NP Thyroid by Acella. Does anyone have any thoughts on this or recommendations on others? I live in the UK.

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      NP Thyroid is a great product, Janella!

      Reply
      • janella brown

        Yes Janie, I have been reading about NP Thyroid and will probably go with this one. I understand it has the least fillers which is what I want as have a lactose intolerance.

        Reply
  62. Sandra

    Has anyone switched to Thyroid-S from thailand? I am just wondering if you have and have you had success feeling better on it.
    Also I believe it has lactose as an ingredient and although I am not lactose intolerant but am dairy sensitive and wasn’t sure if anyone else who is the same has tolerated it?

    Reply
    • Anne

      Yes I have switched to Thyroid-S, I’d prefer not to take it because it has a lot of fillers, but it seems to suit me and so I’ll continue with it for a while. I am casein intolerant and possibly lactose intolerant – it’s been difficult to distinguish the two – but have not had any problems with the lactose in Thyroid-S.

      Reply
  63. Nick

    Just a reminder that this issue is already quite confusing. When people talk about getting a batch of ERFA , it would probably make things clearer if they stated which country it came from.

    I’m still confused about EFRA. Do they make it ALL in Europe, or is some made in Canada?

    I’m on the point of emailing my endo to ask if I can have some liothyronine (T3) as the EFRA I have here isn’t doing anything and I am so ill.

    Reply
    • waveylines

      Hi Nick Some is made in Canada and some is made in Europe…that is my understanding…
      I am also am poorly on the last two batches of Erfa that I have had so -have switched brands -end of my my first day on WP Thyroid -and already the pain is lessening -was not expecting that to happen so quickly….but it is too early to say -might be a placebo effect. I am taking the same dose I would on Erfa. Sadly though switching brands was a step too far for my doctor so looks like I am on my own and once again back to buying it myself. My doctor was fine with me carrying on taking Erfa though even though it was making me so ill! Lol;. I am beyond caring so long as I get better I will buy WP myself……..

      Reply
      • Angie

        ERFA is made entirely in Spain, the old manufacturing plant was in Belgium. Nick, no need to be confused..Manufacturing in Spain started in Dec.

        Reply
        • Nick

          Thanks Angie, So batch numbers are the same for all of irrespective of where we live.

          I’m still awaiting a reply from my(NHS) endo about what he proposes to do. I can’t hassle him because he’s the only person in the NHS who has actually done anything for me in over 30 years.

          I am considering trying to buy some Thyroid-S or Thiroid from Thailand.

          Reply
      • Delann

        Waveylines, I too switched from Erfa to WP thyroid. It has been 7 days and I feel good so far!

        Reply
        • Sarah

          I’m really pleased you’re feeling good on WP. THYROID. I’ve switched to it too from ERFA and so far so good. I just wish I could get it from a pharmacy in the UK. I have to order online from the US.

          Reply
          • waveylines

            Oh thankyou Sarah and Delann -good to hear the WP is working for you both. i am on day three now and feeling better -definitely improving which is a relief. Sarah are you in the uk? If so you can buy it from the Uk if you have prescription whether NHS or private -go onto Thyroid Uk they have a list of sources. Without a prescription you have to buy it abroad….
            I found a letter to my thyroid specialist listing the symptoms that occurred when I went on new reformulated Armour thyroid back in 2011 -they were exactly the same as what I have experienced for the last 6 months on Erfa…. back then in 2011 my symptoms resolved when I went onto Erfa -three years ago…

          • Caz

            Sarah, you can order it form Greenhey Pharmacy in Skelmersdale, UK

          • zai

            Hi everybody is there same one who can help me . I was on Erfa and was doing great , but Icouldn’t get more an til August. So switch to Armour they said it the same but I am not feeling well I feeling hypo again. I am taking the same dose so I am asking if anyone has tried the same and what to do thanks zai

          • Janie Bowthorpe

            Zai, two ideas: have you tried raising the Armour? That might do the trick. Second, if raising doesn’t help, may be time to check adrenals and iron levels.

  64. Marjaana from Finland

    Lucky some of you, in Finland our only options are Erfa or Armour. Or synthetic T4… Not good at all. Doing very
    ill now, I cant start/buy another batch until I know they will work. This current one doesnt. 🙁

    Reply
    • Sandra

      Hi Marjaanna,
      You can try thyroid-s that is from Thailand and see if they will ship to you as another option that I too am looking into as we don’t have options here in Canada as well.
      Google it to find it and they have a facebook page too.

      Reply
  65. Sandra

    So is this it with Erfa? Are we stuck not knowing why so many are sick on different batches? I am feeling better as long as my current batch lasts but then…. who knows with the next. How can they do this to us and get away with it?

    Reply
    • Dianne

      Good questions, Sandra. Looks like as far as ERFA is concerned, they seem to have no further comment. Leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

      Reply
  66. Cynthia

    Canadians, what are our options? I switched to T3 only after I read Janie’s previous post. Doing better, but not great, I was on T3 only a couple of years ago and didn’t work well for me then. Considering a small circadian dose of synthroid, starting at 25 mcg. Other than that I don’t know what to do. I want to get back on desiccated as soon as possible, much like everyone else.

    Reply
  67. Trisha

    Waveylines,

    I MORE than understand. Where if at all can one purchase it? And can one without a Rx? Hope to hear from you! TrishaLHogan@yahoo.com
    Big thanks!

    Reply
  68. Trisha

    Hi,

    Can anyone report any up to date comments Re: either if these two
    ERFA batches – both of 125 mg tabs,
    500 Tablets.

    THANK YOU!!!

    Reply
  69. Trisha

    Trisha
    July 4, 2014
    Hi,
    Can anyone comment or report any up to date info / results of either of these two ERFA batches – Both of 125 mg tabs + 500 Tablets:

    Lot #: 12H021 EXP. 8-31-2015
    Lot #: 13C06 EXP. 3-31-2016

    Sincere thanks & best to our of us for
    our perseverance and courage!! 🙂

    THANK YOU!!!

    Reply
    • Anne

      Trisha I’ve just replied to your previous message about this, sorry not to have seen it sooner – I had problems with a 500 jar of the 125mg 13C06 expiry 3/2016 as did several others. We all bought them from different pharmacies in different countries. Dr Kanfo says it was made in the old factory in Belgium not the new one in Spain and that nothing is wrong with it. I had immediate allergic-type reactions and upset stomach taking it, he suggested I had become allergic to the ingredients, but I am fine on an older batch! I have made a gradual switch to Thyroid-S which was the quickest to get and seems to suit me. As others are saying WP Thyroid is similar to the ‘old’ ERFA and ‘old’ Armour, I may go over to that eventually as there are rather a lot of fillers in Thyroid-S

      Reply
    • waveylines

      yes Trisha _ I agree with Ann -have had major problems with lot 13C06 expiry date 3/2016…..

      Reply
  70. Greta

    Janie, are there any news from Dr. Knafo?

    Reply
  71. Delann

    What the heck was I putting in my body that was making me sick again with hypo symptoms Erfa? What HAVE I been ingesting?

    Some of my thoughts and questions are…. IF indeed the Erfa formula has not changed (or even if it has) since the beginning of 2014 …. 1. I think the tablets were perhaps not pressed correctly along with the addition of a new coating?: 2. Machines maybe were not cleaned properly in between different manufacturing of different products, contamination or coatings from other products still in vat? 3. Un- skilled workers using brand new pressing machines were not familiar with procedure or operations? 4. An entirely different coating more suitable for a new pressing machine was applied to the Erfa pills? And all of his could have bearing on the lack of potency or the blocking of the thyroid hormone in our cells, digestions and conversions? Or, simply put, someone was a sleep at the wheel of the whole manufacturing move without oversight by appropriate people in charge of quality control?

    From my research: Quote in part: “Many tablets today are coated after being pressed. Modern tablet coatings are polymer and polysaccharide based, with plasticizers and pigments included. Tablet coatings must be stable and strong enough to survive the handling of the tablet, must not make tablets stick together during the coating process, and must follow the fine contours of embossed characters or logos on tablets.”

    Note: we can clearly see from the above side by side photos that the “new” pills are shiner, deeper embossed, and have darker pigment and some reporting harder.

    Quote: “The tablet press is an essential piece of machinery for any pharmaceutical manufacturer. Tablet presses must allow the operator to adjust the position of the lower and upper punches accurately, so that the tablet weight, thickness and density can each be controlled. Pharmaceutical tablet presses are required to be easy to clean and quick to reconfigure with different tooling, because they are usually used to manufacture many different products. There are 2 main standards of tablet tooling used in pharmaceutical industry: American standard ‘TSM’ and European standard ‘EU’. TSM and EU configurations are similar to each other but cannot be interchanged.” End of Quotes from my research.
    With that information keep in mind, Erfa HAS eluded to 2 changes within the company; new pressing machine, and the moving of the manufacturing facility from Belgium to Spain. I personally don’t know, but questions I have are, what standard of the above the Spain facility uses with this “new pressing machine?” What did Belgium use with the “old pressing machine” What coatings were used in Belgium plant? What coating is being used in the Spain plant? “Similar but cannot be interchanged” is the phrase I’m questioning here. Also along with, the coatings of “polymer, polysaccharide, plasticizers and pigments, what the heck did Erfa use on these new pills? If some different coating was used, perhaps therein lays the sickness from the new pills? I don’t know.

    However, I’d be surprised if there weren’t some quality control issues along the way in ALL departments of this company’s move, from the worker mixing up the pig powder to adding in the additives/fillers to the person pulling the lever on the pressing machine to decision to us a new coating and All this that will never be reported to the customers under any circumstances for fear of legal retaliation from patients I suspect.

    With complaints flooding in recent months maybe just Maybe a THROUGH INVESTIGATION SHOULD have been done from start to finishing of the thyroid tablets in the manufacturing process!!! Then report the results from ALL THAT TESTING, along with the posting for all of us to see from the independent formula analysis, supposedly done, (remember all we have is Erfa saying so’s and if they had nothing to hide what’s wrong with pdf’n the report in a post?) When this many people start complaining about a thyroid treatment that has served them well by elevating hypo symptoms and now doesn’t since beginning of year, and only one thing was looked into and reported by the company “no change in formulation” and we get told to revisit our doctors because it must be us, then TRUST is broken.

    We patients know when something “ain’t” right with our bodies from the reactions and symptoms we experience in life when taking ANY medication and in this case these “new” Erfa thyroid tablets ARE/and HAVE BEEN the cause of our return of hypothyroid conditions. To me this is Gross negligence on the part of Erfa to report that nothing is wrong with their product when clearly we know there is. AND to now ride off into the sunset with no public announcement to patients, doctors, and pharmacist of ANY kind (that I’m currently aware of) in addressing this situation, in my opinion is a “cover up” of a “goof up” within the companies operations! And who loses in this situation? Both; Us the thyroid patients with ill health and Erfa in loss of sales as we all scramble to find something else that WORKS! Right?

    In conclusion, as I mentioned in my earlier post, I started WP thyroid last week and so far I’m feeling much better! So, Goodbye Erfa to your lack of dedication to your customer’s health by doing EVERYTHING possible to address, find, and correct the problems which have been reported to you in way of symptoms by so many on your thyroid pill since the beginning of the year 2014.. What have you done differently to the thyroid pills? WHAT have we been ingesting into our bodies with your pills that are causing illness! And only a through investigation into all aspects of your manufacturing is going to give all answers.

    And to all my fellow hypo thyroid people, I wish you all the best of health and happiness! And to NEVER have to go through a situation like this EVER again once you find another method of treating your hypo condition!

    Reply
  72. Sandra

    Delann,
    Well spoken!!!! This should not be the end of it as you say. To those of us in Canada, our options to change to another source are limited so it would be a blessing if things were to go back to what they were.
    Does anyone know why Erfa is the only dessicated thyroid available to us north of the border?

    Reply
    • Cynthia

      I would be interested in that answer as well. T3 only is not working for me and need to switch back to NDT as soon as possible.

      Reply
      • Dianne

        I agree, very well said, Delann. Why do I feel like our heartfelt pleas are falling on deaf ears, though?

        And like the other Canadians here, I’d also like to know why more options for ndt are not available here. How can ERFA corner the market? It’s a scary thought since ERFA doesn’t seem to really care about what has happened here, especially knowing that Canadians have no other choice but ERFA. Sounds like we’re hostage.

        Reply
  73. Trisha

    Hi,

    I just wanted to thank you Anne, Waveylines, and you all for your helpful responses. I have decided to forgo on ERFA at this juncture as it is simply too risky at this time… unless AND UNTIL this whole thing gets resolved, even IF it takes a year!

    It’s just too risky in terms of health &
    money right now – period! I am going
    to likely go with the new Westhroid-P,
    and we’ll see about Acella (not as readily
    accessible or available)!

    This indeed is yet another BIG setback for us ALL, & quite frankly, I wish those
    responsible for all this, could just get a TASTE of the outright havoc that we go through on a daily basis affecting our
    baseline functioning, productivity & livelihood because of these endless, pathetic hoops we have to jump through
    from corporate foul play, lack of
    integrity, or regard for humanity! It’s disgraceful.

    I would like to suggest that all of us who
    have lost faith in ERFA, and/or jumped ship for now… write Dr. Knafo directly to inform him!

    Ultimately & certainly over time, ERFA
    will see a drop in sales, so their stellar
    history is about to take an undeniable hit!

    Meanwhile, I think you Canadians should unite for more options!!!

    Also, I would love to hear from anyone out there on Acella… WHERE do you
    reside and WHERE (from what pharmacies are you obtaining your Acella?? I reside in California, & I know of someone in VA, and IT does NOT seem readily or easily available. So your input could help shed some light for us all.

    My sincere thanks & encouragement to
    everyone!

    Reply
  74. Cynthia

    I just called Total Health Pharmacy in Newmarket, the one on Davis Dr. and they are back ordered for ERFA. If I recall earlier comments said someone got a batch with 2017 expiry date and was doing well. And now they can’t get any, whats going on? Did ERFA realize they had bad batches (without admitting it of course) and now have adjustments to make? Why the shortage, I thought the whole reason of moving production to Spain was to keep up with demand.

    Reply
    • Stephanie

      Let’s hope they are quietly fixing the problem. They can’t admit that there is a problem with any of the batches for liability reasons.

      Reply
  75. Sandra

    Hi all,
    I will be out of my current batch of 30 mg pills in 5 days that I have been feeling well on and the next batch that I will be picking up from pharmacy is
    Lot LF03506A expiry Feb 2017.
    Is anyone on this batch and feeling ok on it?

    thanks!

    Reply
    • Cynthia

      Hi Sandra, are you getting your refill from Total Health Pharmacy on Davis Dr? I ask because when I called they said they were back-ordered.

      Reply
      • Sandra

        Hi Cynthia,
        You are right, I did call and they said the same thing. Then I called another pharmacy I use for my testosterone, The Medicine Shoppe in Oshawa and I was going to see how I do on this batch before I let you know. She has lots of it though, said something like 3 bottles of 500 of the 30 mg.

        Reply
      • Sandra

        Hi Cynthia,
        I have started the new batch and will let you know how I am doing in a week.

        Reply
        • Cynthia

          Thank you for keeping me updated.

          Reply
          • Sandra

            Hi Cynthia,
            I have come to the conclusion that this batch is not as good, I have been having issues on and off of various hypo symptoms. I had my bloodwork done last week and will see in a couple of weeks but I don’t need bloodwork to tell me something is not right with this batch.

    • Nick

      Sandra, I have a batch of LF3507A, expiry 02/17 that are not working. So I would be wary of LF3506A. LF3508A is the batch that has been reported as working OK..

      Pharmarama in the UK have LF3508A in stock but will not sell it until all their stocks of LF3507A are gone. After all profits are far more important than people’s health. 😉

      I guess we need a way of all UK ERFA users coming together to make some sort of legal challenge.

      Reply
      • Sandra

        Thanks Nick, I guess I have to take a chance and see, I won’t get much filled this time, just a pain as it is a 45 minute drive to get there to go back if it works and I need more.
        My other option is to call everywhere and find my current batch.
        So you are saying that they deny a person who request a certain batch/lot!!!!!? That is just down right ridiculous. Since there is really nothing wrong and 10,000 patients on “Thyroid” and just 75 of us sick then what is the problem since it may only be a few who want a certain batch!
        I would not settle for that, call who ever you have to to get the right batch.

        Reply
        • waveylines

          I emailed Dr Knafo again to ask him why i had become so ill on Erfa after three years of feeling good on it. He emailed very promptly back and said the following:-
          ” In deed I did not receive your last emails. Therefore I am sorry for the late reply. I am happy to hear that you are feeling better in WP Thyroid. The investigation didn’t reveal anything wrong with the medication, however, I am still monitoring patients and complaints.
          From my experience there is a few patients that don’t tolerate the medication even after years of treatment. I cannot explain why but this is a reality. ”

          Anyone heard of developing problems with a specific NDT when well established on it -when vitamins and minerals are good, adrenals too? I can’t find anything on this -have looked. And why would I improve by switching brands – on WP Thyroid -although I am still crashing if I do physical activity for any length of time -but then I haven’t been well for months and only been on WP for 10days….!!.

          Am confused -any thoughts anyone?

          Thank you again for the follow up and I wish you a good health.

          Reply
          • Dianne

            “From my experience there is a few patients that don’t tolerate the medication even after years of treatment. I cannot explain why but this is a reality.”

            Argh. All I can is, when I took the tablets from the two bad batches I tried (and felt like I was dying), and then took tablets from the old stock that I was able to find, I felt immediately better (back to the ‘norm’ for me) on the old stock. So, that ‘explanation’ from Dr. Knafo is not valid.

          • Angie

            I agree with Dianne..and where is Janie? This is a ridiculous explanation from Dr. Knafo and lessens him in my opinion. Like Dianne, I went back and forth from the OLD ERFA to the NEW ERFA and experienced problems on the batches obtained in early 2014. It is not a sudden inability on my part to take ERFA, if that were so I could not have taken the older meds. It is a DIFFERENCE in the medication itself. I have sent several emails now to Dr. Knafo that have not been responded. to. Coupled with the above and the openness to show the results of the investigation and testing only if one traveled to Toronto makes me entirely suspicious. I have a batch that will expire in 2017..will check lot #”s, etc. If this is also a bad batch, I will report both them and The Canadian Pharmacy to Health Canada and my doc here in the USA.

          • Delann

            Waveylines, my thoughts on that email are the following:

            To Quote Dr. Knafo that: “The investigation didn’t reveal anything wrong with the medication; however, I am still monitoring patients and complaints. From my experience there are a few patients that don’t tolerate the medication even after years of treatment. I cannot explain why but this is a reality. ” …

            If, “the investigation didn’t reveal anything wrong with the medication…..then what is wrong with a POST of the essay showing it for all of us to see? Also, I for one would like to see posted documents and evidence from research and case studies that show that his “reality” statement is true! Not just his “say so”. I would like to know what patients he is monitoring and from where, his office? Or, from a blog site such as this one with people he has never met personally, did any personal testing on, or interviewed face to face in an office with questions and answers as to their symptoms, because I am NOT HIS patient! (However, I “was a customer”). Or, as the medical director of a pharmaceutical company is he implying that he has a personal practice also with Hypothyroid patients of whom he is seeing and they TOO are having difficulties on any brand of NDT? What evidence is he backing that statement of “this is a reality” with? He states (from HIS experience) “that there are a few people who do not tolerate the NDT after years of treatment and that is a Reality”? What experience, please. I ask you all reading this, what “few patients” would tolerate a med for “YEARS of treatment” that wasn’t working!!! That is contrary to all reason or common sense!

            I say he should start producing a whole bundle of research studies, and documentations to back up some of the statements he has been making since the up rise of complaints with these non working batches of thyroid meds and quit shooting out statements like that and own up to the facts that this med is messed up and responsibility lies at his and the companies door!

            In his earlier response to Janie above on this page he says “that each person complaining should be handled on an individual basis with their doctors to consider “other variables” Well guess what I HAVE considered other variables and since there are no other variables in my personal life that have changed, the variables I am considering (that I am aware of) are: 1. the change in Erfa manufacture plant and 2. New pressing machines, 3. A possible cover up in the Erfa Company that they are not admitting to from spotty mismanaged quality control and oversight with in that company with those changes.

            He doesn’t fool me with his glossed over double talking, no proof explanations, said, no doubt, from the perspective of, “protect my job” point of view. We all here on this blog site, as well as people on other sites, know that something went wrong with the making of this thyroid medication since the move of their company and the beginning of 2014 PERIOD! Maybe we should all be directing or concerns to the C.E.O, or president of this Erfa Company instead of Dr. Knafo?

            A through and independent investigation should be started immediately as to prevent harm to many that may still be ingesting these pills because they have no choice and holding on to maybe, just maybe the pills have enough of an element of t3/t4 in them that is working just enough to keep them half way functioning, while suffering weakening, symptoms that could be related to contamination, change in additives or filler, tablet coatings or low quality pig thyroid powder, or who knows what! It is truly frustrating me that they are not investigating this matter seriously.

            We all have a right to quality of life and not to settle for such condescending remarks comments, and statements that are coming from the medical “director” Dr. Knafo as facts that are unproven, and short on truth of what is really going on within that company! Fact is, they had a product that served us all well for years until the beginning of 2014. You simply do not tell this many hypothyroid people that are complaining that “nothing is wrong” on Erfa’s end of things! We all know that it worked very well at one time, and now it is not and that, Dr. Knafo, is REALITY!

        • Nick

          I get my ERFA through the NHS, and fortunately don’t have to pay for it. But that means getting it prescribed by my endo, who then sends the prescription to the hospital pharmacy, who in turn order it from this company called Pharmarama.

          So I don’t actually get to talk to either the hospital pharmacy or the supplier. As such the ERFA supplies come in order of the batch date and number, and the hospital pharmacy has to accept them unless there is official recognition that something is wrong with a batch. So while ERFA continue to deny that there is any problem, patients in my position have to accept what they give us.

          Reply
  76. Sarah

    Are there any recent updates? Does anyone know? This is really frustrating.

    Reply
  77. shirley

    This is all very very interesting. I have been on efra for years and have been doing very well UNTIL january of 2014. Since january my benign irregular heartbeat has gone out of control. Had all sorts of test and all came back negative. My cardiologist was willing to put me on a calcium beta blocker if I wanted to give it a try. I’m not a pill person so did not want to start taking this unless it was necessary. So, up until a week ago, I have been suffering with the irregualrity… it was getting worse every month. Since january I had taken cardiac PX that worked before however this time it was doing little to correct the irregularity. I began to test all supplements I was taking as well as any foods. Nothing worked. As a last resort and with the support of my naturalpath, I started reducing my efra and did begin to get some releief. I then had my thyroid test done and all was out of wack (because i had reduced it by a third ie took 60 instead of 90). My family doc convinced me to stop reducing and to go back to the 90. The irregularity came back as bad as ever. After finding your site I convinced my doc to switch me to USPP thyroid done up by a local pharmacy. I’ve been on this for just about a week and boy what a difference. It was almost instant. My heart is almost normal. I’m putting this out there because I know how concerned you can get when your metabolism is out of wack and your life gets out of sorts. Wondering if anyone else has experienced this or has found improvements by switching to a new brand? I’m on the USPP formula for the next month. I’ll let you know how things go, if anyone is interested. I’m thinking if after a month my irregularity is resolved that I will send an email to erfa to let them know and perhaps advise Health Canada. If this is an efra issue I wonder if legal action is required to get them to take action and/or to avoid others having to go through this? Thanks to everyone for sharing your experiences and your expertice. Looking forward to future updates.

    Reply
    • Nick

      I’ve noticed a similar irregularity since about February this year (along with other symptoms of hypothyroidism). It’s something I had until I went on NDT about 7 years ago. I would like to see legal action against ERFA but I suspect that it would be a very long case, and difficult to actually prove anything.

      Like Sarah, I am desperately awaiting developments on this issue. If I can’t get an alternative NDT through my NHS endo, I think that I will have to order some Thyroid or Thiroid-S from Thailand. We do need more reports about the batch LF03508 Exp. Feb 17 to see if the problem with ERFA has been resolved. I would prefer to stick with ERFA because it can be taken sublingually.

      Reply
    • Sandra

      Shirley,
      Absolutely please do let us know how you are doing.

      Reply
  78. Sandra

    Hi all,
    I have started a new batch of pills 3 days ago, Lot LF03506A expiry Feb 2017 and won’t jump the gun but the following has happened, joint pain, fatigue and now stomach distress/issues. I fell asleep on the sofa last night which I never do and didn’t even make it for my regular walk as I usually do.
    I will keep you posted.

    Reply
  79. Sandra

    Delann,
    You have a good suggestion that we go above Dr. Knafo and perhaps with Janie’s help we should move forward.
    Janie, any suggestions? What about the newspapers here in Canada, or the companies shareholders? I’m sure they would like to know about the reason that their sales will decline.
    Janie I’m curious, how did things turn out with respect to Armour in the end?
    Dr Knafo,
    If you are reading this, here is my reality.
    Today I will drive 1 1/2 hours to see my brother who last past February broke his tibia in three places, developed compartment syndrome. He is a one man show marina operator, a mechanic and a volunteer fire captain along with running snow plow contracts in winter (plowing himself) and shovelling where necessary, snow. He has not walked since then except for a little on crutches as necessity and recently endured another operation to close up the wound but has to bed rest for two weeks to prevent the stitches from breaking the wound open.
    He has very little help, cannot afford to have help and I planned to go see him to do whatever he needs to help but in my current state of low energy I don’t see myself of being of much help. I pray it changes that, that something changes with my energy today because all I want to do is help my brother, help my family.
    You have robbed me of that.
    I wonder, do you sleep well at night?

    Reply
  80. Trisha

    Keep the updates coming!
    For now, I returned my ERFA (unopened), am taking Armour temporarily for now (which I had),
    but am planning to go to a private
    physician to get a Rx for either
    Acella NP, Westhroid WP, or BOTH!

    ERFA must remain on hold until ALL
    of this is resolved, which unfortunately,
    I think is going to take close to a year – if at all? IF the latter, then ERFA has ruined their stellar history! Another good
    horse down – what a shame!

    This is beyond pathetic & a travesty what
    we with hypothyroidism must endure &
    navigate! A TOTAL SHAM!!!

    Reply
    • Nick

      I’m not sure if it will take a year Trish. If the LF03508 batch IS OK then we are good to go again. The only problem being how much of the ‘bad stuff’ is floating around pharmacies that they will expect us to use up first.

      If ERFA users won’t accept the ‘bad stuff’ and find an alternative product, sales of ERFA will simply stagnate. I would have thought it good business sense for ERFA to pull all the ‘bad stuff’ sooner rather than later.

      Just a thought; imagine if this had happened with all levothyroxine!

      Reply
      • Angie

        Nick, my new batch is 30 mg LF03508A, exp 2/2017. I’ll let you guys know how I do.

        Reply
  81. Angie

    I have ordered a new batch with an expiration date of 2017. I will let you all know how I do. I am not doing that well on the WP. Do reasonably well on Nature-throid, but the fillers aggravate my diverticulitis and had an acute episode just a little over a week ago and had to switch back to the WP. I don’t seem to absorb the WP all that well. I am hoping that my new batch of ERFA is an improvement over the two batches I received early in 2014. If they are not, then I will report my concerns to Health Canada. My objective is not to sue anybody, but quite simply, wellness. I have pointed many thyroid users to ERFA as it used to be a superior product. Obviously I can not continue to do so if it performs poorly.

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      Angie, make sure your absorption issue isn’t more related to not being on enough NDT…or being here: http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/ndt-doesnt-work-for-me

      Reply
      • Angie

        Hey Janie: I’ve been a thyroid pt since 1996 and am aware of the iron and cortisol issues (also watch my RT3 and total T3 closely). Since I feel fine on the [older] Nature-throid at an equivalent dose (I chew it and take with a little juice) to the WP, don’t think “not enough” is the issue, but it certainly feels like not enough. Don’t know why I don’t do very well on the WP (West-throid)..should do fine, but I don’t. My more recent batch of N-T doesn’t feel like enough either..are we starting to see an issue overall with all dessicated? With the ERFA, my labs on the newer batches were all good, but didn’t feel well. Would switch back to the older N-T or the older ERFA that I had left and feel fine. Almost feels like perhaps one of the “trace amount” ingredients are missing OR there is a contamination issue. Again, will be trying a later expiry date batch of ERFA (should be here today or tomorrow) and will keep y’all posted..

        Reply
        • Janie Bowthorpe

          Hi Angie. No, there are no problems with NDT overall. Just Erfa. That’s why I’m wondering if something has changed in you, like iron or cortisol. But I hope you figure it out soon!

          Reply
          • Angie

            Thanks, Janie..let’s keep our eyes and ears open. My later N-T (have never done well on WP) is on the weak side also. My “new” ERFA (expir date 2017) just came in the mail. We shall see!!!

    • Nick

      It’s bad enough to be hypo, worse to find that we don’t respond to thyroxine, and then worse still, many of us seem to only do well on certain types of NDT, which (worse still) appear to change in quality from time to time. I’m never sure if I am more fatigued from being hypo, or for trying to manage it.

      Reply
  82. Trisha

    Thanks for the feedback y’all. Whether it takes a year or not, I think it’s going to take some time still… there are too many batches out there that have been mentioned as falling short; batches of
    30 mg, 60 mg, and 125 mg.
    To me, it WON’T be cleared up until
    no negative reports come in – period! Otherwise, it’s Russian Roulette, & good
    medication & health CAN’T be a game of rolling the dice! Hang in there! I HOPE ERFA comes back, but only time will tell.

    Reply
  83. Cathy

    Hi !
    I’m a patient and I have been treated with Erfa since November 2013. I was finally seeing results until I started a new bottle in late June… I have lost all appetite, my digestion is a mess, I can’t sleep, my head hurts like hell…
    Unfortunately, my pharmacist doesn’t have any good batch for now, and doesn’t want me to return what I’ve bought, but I’m a student and I don’t have a lot of money, so it’s difficult for me to change meds like that (and I’m in Europe so I don’t have a lot of other options).
    Do you think increasing the dosage with the batch I’m on could help ? If it’s a problem of coating causing a bad absorption, it could work right ?
    I checked my iron and cortisol levels, iron is still a little low but better and increasing, and I was feeling quite fine before even with this level so I’m sure it can’t be it.
    Please help me, I’m traveling for three weeks starting Monday and I’m desperate.
    Cathy

    Reply
    • Catarina

      Cathy,

      Increasing the dosage might help if, for whatever reason, the new pills absorb less well. Add half a grain and see how you feel. If it helps, you should feel the difference quickly. If you feel better, but not optimal, you can keep raising it until it relieves your symptoms. This could help if impaired absorption is the only reason you feel worse.

      Reply
  84. Sheryl

    Angie, I too have switched from Erfa to WP and am not doing well. My doc ordered labs to see why I am not absorbing this stuff and wants me back on 60mg of Erfa 3x a day. I am hoping for a good batch. What’s my chances? Looking forward to your update.

    Reply
  85. Angela

    Has anyone switched over to Thyroid-S or Thiroyd successfully and which one works for you?

    Reply
  86. Angie

    Update…somewhat long…sorry.

    I am now on my 3rd day of 30 mg batch LF03508A. It seems to be, if a little on the weak side, more like what I am used to from ERFA. At least as yet, no profound fatigue or other sickness that I had on my early 2014 batches. Will continue to keep you all updated.

    I did hear back, interestingly enough, from Dr. Knafo. He stated that he had had problems getting emails to me (a couple had bounced back) and that he was checking in to see how I was doing. He also stated that results of ERFA’s investigation would be made available to any that would sign a disclaimer. Here is my response to Dr. Knafo. I once again want to say that he has always been very helpful in the past. Willing to answer questions and genuinely concerned that his product be safe and effective for the customers buying it. He may be simply overwhelmed with the number of complaints and/or have his hands tied by his superiors.

    Dear Dr. Knafo:
    I am not sure why you had problems getting emails to me directly, but I can report that no one else has indicated to me that they have had a problem. Could this perhaps be a an issue at your end?

    Since you have sent me two emails (and I have sent subsequent emails to mine below which have gone unanswered), I will answer both.

    Yes. I did have bloodwork done. My FT4 and FT3 levels were a little on the high side with the “new” ERFA. However, I was not well on this medicine as I have reported many times. Gastro-intestinal issues, profound fatigue with a heavy chest feeling, brain-fog and a drop in mood. The fatigue and heavy chest feeling were serious enough for me to have visited my primary care physician twice. I have read, from others experiencing problems, that you have attributed the problems that many of us have had on the new medication to a sudden inability to tolerate ERFA. This is very disappointing to me. As I believe I conveyed to you, I did have a small amount of older, 60 mg tabs that I did not experience the same problems on. I went back and forth 2-3 times between the old and new formulas and did not have the same problems on the old. I did experience, on the older formula, a “drop” in effectiveness. However, as I usually have to increase my meds by about 1/4 grain in the colder months of the year, I assumed that it was not the med, but the seasonal change that was the problem. So…this was not a sudden inability to “tolerate” ERFA. If folks had problems on the older batches, I can not really speak to that. My issues started with the prescription refills that I obtained from The Canadian Pharmacy in early 2014.

    Since I have spoken with you, I have once again attempted to try ERFA (batch LF03508A) expiry 2/2017. Since I have only been on it a couple of days, I can not really give any meaningful report, but early indications seem to be that this batch may be a little more what I am used to from ERFA. I am happy to keep you posted, if you would like.

    I want to once again speak to the fact that I was once ERFA’s biggest fan. This dessicated thyroid worked for me like none other and helped me return to wellness in late 2009. Since that time, I have taken ERFA with few problems until early 2014. I have noticed that it seems to be sensitive to temps and can expire early if I do not store it in a cool place in the warmer months of the year. I am disappointed that ERFA seems to be attributing 170 or so patient complaints to patient problems and apparently not investigating this thoroughly or if you have, communicating the specifics of that investigation. I have always looked to the Canadian Healthcare System and Canadian companies in general as good examples for our American system and company to follow. I sincerely hope I can continue to do so.

    I am very much interested in viewing the results (please let me know whom/where to direct my inquires) of your investigation of the problem. I am also happy to sign a disclaimer as long as it is not a “gag” of sorts if I see problems that might affect my health or the health of other people. I am not interested in a lawsuit, I am interested in wellness as I have every right and responsibility to be. I await your response!

    Angie Frye
    Raleigh, NC

    Reply
    • Nick

      Great letter Angie. And what looks like an endorsement for batch LF03508A!

      Reply
    • Anne

      I like your letter Angie and it’s good to know that the latest batch you have may be ok. I too got an email from Dr Knafo this week asking for an update and if I had seen my GP. I was able to tell him much the same as you, that an older batch was working fine, so it’s not a sudden allergy to ERFA. Unfortunately my endocrinologist offered me a prescription for Armour only and I know I don’t get on with that any more, so I’m now on Thyroid-S, but would far prefer to get some decent ERFA. I have also found him to be helpful in the past and am glad that he’s contacting us again, it shows that he is concerned and does want to know if our blood tests show anything out of the ordinary, or if there is some rational explanation that applies to some of us. If it’s a question of incorrect storage of either the ingredients or the tablets somewhere, or a machine going haywire or not having being programmed correctly, he probably really doesn’t know and is as mystified as we are. I don’t think ERFA has been reformulated, the experiences different people are having don’t point to that, but I hope whatever has happened is discovered soon and we can get back to normal, meanwhile I hope you find your latest batch is good and we can all get some!

      Reply
    • Evelyn Kjørstad

      Well done Angie. Thank’s for keeping updates – ups – GREAT updates 🙂

      Reply
      • Angie

        All..after a few weeks on the batch # indicated, I am sorry to report that it is also causing me problems. While a day or so are okay, eventually I feel weak and shaky and have no ability to handle stress. Now before any jump in to talk to me about adrenals, I don’t think this is the issue as when I switch back to Nature-throid, I do not have this problem. I plan on reporting once more to Dr. Knafo. I have had no response to my above email at all. Including no response to my request for the investigation of the new product.

        Reply
  87. Tammy

    Thanks for the update Angie. I have enough of the old Erfa to last until Feb-Mar next year. I hope they get this issue with Erfa resolved. I don’t want to switch brands again. I have been doing good on Erfa since I started taking it back during the Armour reformulation. I will keep checking here for updates. Hope when I order some later this year they will work for me. I don’t understand why these companies make changes to medications that are working for people. Can you still take this new formulation sublingually? That’s how I take the Erfa I have been using & that’s how I used Armour until they reformulated it. Thanks.

    Reply
    • Nick

      I’ve been taking the ‘new’ ERFA sublingually Tammy. I didn’t try that with the older ‘working’ ERFA so can’t say what the difference is to swallowing it..

      Reply
  88. waveylines

    A little update, I have now been on WP thyroid for nearly a month and feel so much better -finally I have energy – feel like I am getting my life back. I have finally been able to resume my normal hot summer dose of 3 !/2 grains per day. if I had another condition inhibiting or causing my symptoms then I would not be improving on WP Thyroid surely.
    How on earth can Erfa say there is not a problem with their Thyroid I really don’t know.
    Over in the UK my GP and pharmacist have done their own investigations and found out there is problem -the word is out Dr Knafo -you do need to get this sorted. I am going to see my Endocrinologist today and will be discussing what has happened. over the 6 months of decline ( having done well on Erfa for three years before) I have put on 3 stone in weight!!! This is in part because I have not been able to do any form of sustained activity but 3 stone? I do not buy the argument that I have been given by Dr Knafo that I have developed resistance to Erfa Thyroid but will discuss this with the Endocrinoligist I am seeing today.
    I am incredibly grateful to this site -thank you so much Janie -without or the comments on here and elsewhere I may not have twigged for a while longer -the last time I felt so poorly with all the symptoms that i have had ( now all going again :)) is before I was diagnosed!!! never not even on levothyroxine have I felt so ill on thyroid treatment -and believe me that is saying something! Yes my anger is still there. For a start I now have 3 stone to shift!!! I am grateful that my employer has been so understanding as I have not been able to work for 5 weeks. Now feeling like I could resume and sustain work soon -what a relief.
    Thank you thank you thank you to you all on here………

    Reply
    • Anne

      “Over in the UK my GP and pharmacist have done their own investigations and found out there is problem”

      Waveylines that sentence is intriguing, are you able to elaborate and tell us what they found out? Or if not are they taking it any further? I’m taking Thyroid-S at the moment but am not keen on all the fillers so it’s good to know you’re getting on well with WP Thyroid.

      Reply
      • Dianne

        waveylines, I second Anne’s request. If you are able to tell us what they found out we would greatly appreciate it.

        Reply
      • waveylines

        So Sorry Dianne & Tammy for my late reply -been away 🙂 My Gp said he had done his own investigations and had found out that there is a problem with Erfa Thyroid -he said they have changed countries and they have changed the pressers for their tablets. i said could a different presser reduce the efficacy of the tablet -he said yes. Both he and my pharmacist are of the opinion that Erfa has changed -he was really different with me -very compassionate as he totally got why i wanted to change brands. However in the Uk getting a NDT on the NHS is no easy thing so had to go to a private enlightened Endocrinologist to get the ok for brand change… -Of course as i sad I had changed brands in any case -can’t carry on feeling so ill if I can avoid it.
        The Endocrinologist was not impressed with Erfa Thyroid -not because it is a NDT -but she said she had many patients complaining of it’s lack of efficacy for them so her opinion was that it is right to switch brands -though she wasn’t happy that I had done it without medical supervision.

        Reply
        • Anne

          Thanks for getting back to us Waveylines. My endocrinologist wasn’t at all amused to hear about the changes to ERFA either, but he only offered me Armour, and said that would have to be on a private prescription, so I’m trying out Thyroid-S at the moment and thinking of getting some WP Thyroid as most people seem to get on with that. If only the NHS would even believe I need thyroid hormones… but they don’t!

          Reply
        • Anne

          Actually Waveylines there is something else – I bought batch 13C06 expiry 03/2016, which I think you also have, in November 2013, so a month before the production changed to Spain, therefore the new pressing machines etc can’t have had any effect on them, something else is wrong with them.

          Reply
        • Dianne

          Thanks for answering our question waveylines. 🙂

          Reply
    • Nick

      ” never not even on levothyroxine have I felt so ill on thyroid treatment -and believe me that is saying something! ”

      That’s exactly how I feel now waveylines. I’ve not been quite this bad for so long a period. It’s as though it is actually doing harm rather than just not working. Or perhaps once we get used to thyroid medication that works, we become more dependent on it, and feel worse when it is taken away!

      Reply
      • Janie Bowthorpe

        Nick, every human being is dependent on their thyroid hormones. i.e. dependency has nothing to do with “getting used to thyroid medication”. It’s a biological dependency.

        Reply
    • Sandra

      Waveylines,
      I am so happy to hear you are doing well on an alternate thyroid treatment, it is bitter sweet, sad that you have had to endure this and loose your employment income for 5 weeks. Reading this on a day that seems not as good for me gives me hope that the comings and goings of energy, depression, etc can be remedied with a change to another source. Please keep us posted on your feedback from your appointments and I too would love to know what the findings are by your GP and your pharmacist.
      Thank you for your feedback!

      Reply
  89. Sara

    Is this what has been happening to me??? I had a two bottles from my pharmacy of Erfa (picked them up earlier this year) and about two months ago one morning, i opened the bottle that was finishing and it smelled strongly of rotten fish. I’ve been taking Erfa for 3/4 years now and I had never had my pills smell that badly. I thought weird and the pills went bad. So I opened the new bottle and it had the same strong smell. Because it had never happened before, I took it back to my pharmacist and insisted on getting replacements for it. She kept telling me that it was normal and I told her, that I’ve been taking this for years and I never had this before and because she and I didn’t know why it smelled so rotten, i wasn’t going to mess around my thyroid and continue to take them. She didn’t want to replace them and kept saying I mustve left them out in the heat or something. I just continued arguing with her and she finally replaced them and said she would send them to the lab and they would contact me. I really just thought it was one bad batch. When someone at the lab contacted me they wanted to know if i had left the pills in heat or something. I said no, in my cabinet as always. I wish I’d paid more attention to whom I was talking to but i just dismissed it all as one bad batch.
    Now I’m half way through the replacement bottle and I opened it this morning and the smell is back. So i started to google and saw this posting. I realize my depression has been hitting me more than usual and my hair is falling out even more in the shower. is this just me being paranoid or could it have something to do with the pills? I’m going to call my pharmacy tomorrow morning again and get the info for the lab. Is it safe to take this pills despite the smell? Any help would be appreciated, thanks.

    Reply
  90. Mary

    Just picked up my prescription from Costco ( armour 60 mg 120 pills) and was shocked to find the price has doubled from $20 to $40. So I need to find a better price. Any ideas? Also, what is the WP some of you are referring to? I checked my book and couldn’t find any reference.

    Reply
  91. Catarina

    I got a 500 ct bottle of 125 mg Erfa pills (batch 13C06), exp 03/16) a few months ago (from a pharmacy in Belgium), and only read this today. Since starting on this bottle, I have had to raise my dose from 6 to 8 grains daily; yet, my most recent labs showed barely mid-range FT4 levels, and FT3 levels were not at the top of the range where they used to be. I emailed Dr. Knafo about this, and his reply was: “8 grains is an awfully high dose. Have you had your TSH checked?”

    I had a closer look at the pills, and it seems me to me that some are brighter than others…some seem more yellow. Could new and old formula be mixed in one bottle…?

    Anyway, I have seriously considered switching to another brand these past few weeks, since it has been very difficult to make Erfa work properly…at least this bottle. I don’t know if other batches are any better?

    Reply
    • Anne

      Catarina that is the batch that several of us have had problems with, including Waveylines above whose doctor and pharmacist have apparently investigated and found a problem with them.

      Mine were bought last November (so why are they still in circulation in Belgium?) and they gave me immediate stomach upsets. I only took them for three days before complaining to Dr Knafo. He alleged that I must have become intolerant of ERFA Thyroid but I pointed out that I am fine with an older batch. He also said they were from the old manufacturer in Belgium and not the new one in Spain and that n-one else had complained about that batch, but I know of four others who have done and they live far apart – from Canada to Finland. Mine look exactly the same as before but don’t have such a strong smell as before. I think you are the first person to say that that batch looks different, so I too wonder if they are being mixed up.

      Please continue to complain about this to Dr Knafo, we have to find out what has happened so that we can hopefully one day regain our trust in ERFA. I have switched to a different brand but it is too soon to say whether they are going to be ok or not.

      Reply
    • Mo

      Caterina , I get my erfa from a pharmacy in Belgium and took lot 13co6 expiry 3/16 125mg -underwent slow decline. Now on new batch lot LFO3728A and not convinced they are any better but only taken for 2 weeks. Did you swap to a different NDT?

      Reply
  92. Catarina

    Anne,

    Thanks for this input! To my dismay, I saw that two 100 ct bottles (125 mg pills) that I got in Belgium on June 30th belong to the same batch…so yes, they were still in circulation in Belgium a month ago…hopefully, the problems only concerned this particular batch!

    I looked again and, unless my eyes are playing tricks on me, the pills are two different colors (grayish and more yellow)…

    I will contact Erfa again, now that they are aware of the problem, and stress that my pills belong to the same batch (when I contacted H Knafo, I had no idea about this).

    Reply
  93. Catarina

    Also, the 100 ct bottles I got in June do not look like anything I’ve seen before; it’s a white bottle with a transparent label (blue print), and you don’t screw the lid to open the bottle…it does not seem possible to upload photos here but, like I said, it does not look anything like the previous bottles. Also, on this new bottle, the address of the manufacturer is not mentioned anywhere; all the label says is: “THYROID ERFA 125 mg 100co Lot: 13C06 Exp: 03/16”. In other words, no prescribing or dosage information, no DIN number (to the left on the other labels), no code to scan…it does not even have the Erfa logo.

    Reply
    • Anne

      I wonder if your pharmacy dispensed the tablets from either a different batch or a larger batch. Are you able to ask them? I also think it would be an idea of you could photograph both jars, some of the tablets to show how different they all look, and send the photo to Dr Knafo. I doubt he’d be pleased to know that batches have been mixed up if that’s the case, and if not then it’s definitely something he needs to know about.

      I believe the old manufacturing plant was run by Parke-Davies, I wonder who runs the new one. Does anyone know?

      Reply
  94. Chris

    This thought occurred to me… With so many observed changes in the way Erfa works (or doesn’t); might the responsibility of those changes rest with suppliers of raw materials to Erfa, rather than with Erfa themselves having knowingly made any changes?

    My reasons for choosing Erfa in the first place were: (assuming that under EU guidelines that “Belgian” porkers were:)
    1. Less likely to have been “factory farmed”
    2. Less likely to have been fed antibiotics
    3. Less likely to have been fed any GMO feed
    4. Less likely to have been given any fluoride in their water source

    In recent months, maybe those pigs on which we have come to rely, have been raised somewhere other than Belgium; and were actually subjected to one or more of the above four reasons why I chose Erfa; as well as some as yet unimagined causes. And maybe problems discovered with the product were behind the move of manufacturing from Belgium to Spain.

    A few years back, the substance melamine was found to have tainted numerous brands of pet foods. Did all of those brands knowingly incorporate melamine in their product in order to have it ‘test’ with a higher protein content than it actually deserved? Or were they victims of their own suppliers of raw materials? The reason why so many dogs and cats died, escaped discovery for quite some time. When the cause was finally realized, and deliberately looked for, melamine turned up in a surprising number of places. Might Erfa be dealing with a similar situation?

    Reply
    • Catarina

      Chris,

      Very interesting indeed!

      Erfa has consistently denied making any deliberate changes to Thyroid (cf Armour Pharmaceuticals and RLC Labs that never denied reformulating Armour and Nature-Throid, even if their reasons for doing so are not very clear to me), so your theories actually do make a lot of sense.

      Are you in Europe? I’m asking because it’s not often anyone outside the EU refers to EU guidelines:-)

      Reply
      • Chris

        Catarina, I am in California, but aware that Europe has different standards from what goes on here in North America.

        Reply
    • Catarina

      Chris (and others),

      According to this interview, Erfa gets its raw material from North America, and then the pills themselves used to be manufactured in Belgium (then manufacturing was moved to Spain last year, it seems?!) I guess this means that the raw material (porcine thyroid) was (and still is) harvested in North America, then shipped to Europe (Belgium), where it was processed and manufactured, and this continues to be the case, only the raw material is now shipped to Spain instead of Belgium…?

      https://ruthroland.wordpress.com/?s=strictly+North+American+porcine

      Catarina

      Reply
      • Chris

        Thank you Catarina for posting that article; although sadly, I am disillusioned. The principal reasons for which I chose Erfa have been dashed. Like it or not, it appears that we have probably been taking thyroid that includes all those points I was trying to avoid: “Factory Farmed”, antibiotic laced, GMO fed, and possibly fluoride watered animals. As long as Erfa buys their raw materials elsewhere, I would much rather see them get their NDT from a country famous for their ham production, Denmark.

        Reply
    • Colette

      Chris thank you, I’ve been scanning comments for information on wether or not the thyroid comes from pigs that have been fed GMO feed? I avoid gmo every chance I get and try to eat mostly organic, so I’m very concerned about the source. Most of us know that GMO’s are toxic, and I just read today about piglets born with deformities who mothers were fed gmo soy feed and had very high concentrations of Glyfosate (that’s in Roundup, Monsanto owned). I would hate to imagine that for the last 10 years I’ve been ingesting poison through a medicine that I need to keep me alive. I took Armour which worked great before they screwed it up and have been taking Erfa since then. I am having issues, but not sure if it’s the Erfa not working right, my own hormones or if my ferritin levels are off. Getting more blood work tomorrow so hopefully I’ll know a little more in a few weeks.

      Reply
      • Chris

        Colette, while reading your reply, this thought hit me… Isn’t the EU supposed to ban GMOs? They even refer to them as “Franken Food”. (Franken… as in Frankenstein, not Al Franken!) We ought to have Nation wide labeling laws to keep such products out of their commerce, even if we can’t seem to keep them out of ours.

        Something else I have heard, is that Roundup is even used on non “Roundup Ready” crops, such as wheat, to deliberately kill the mature plants, and speed up the grain’s drying time in the field, prior to storage. Might there be binders gleaned from such cellulose?

        Reply
    • Anne

      Chris I think that the problem is outside ERFA’s control or sphere too. Any one of your suggestions could be correct and, reading about how they source the pigs’ thyroid, I also think that there’s plenty of opportunity for the raw material to be damaged somehow in transit. This would all explain why Dr Knafo is taking it seriously (because I think he is taking it seriously) but not coming up with anything. I do think it would be helpful to know what Waveylines’ GP and pharmacist have discovered (post above), but probably there’s a good reason why she hasn’t told us.

      Reply
  95. Trisha

    Hi,

    Suggestion: Everyone who has jumped ship from ERFA out of total necessity, should make a post saying so. Then Dr. Knafo can read these one after another
    for evidence.

    We are NOT stupid! We KNOW our bodies like no one else, and no one else EVER will! We are informed & resourceful, and we KNOW our medications (with some of us having been on Armour or ERFA, and others for
    YEARS)! It is NOT in our heads, it is in
    our cells… systemically throughout our bodiesand we know what works and what doesn’t – period!

    I for one… am OFF ERFA until this whole thing gets totally resolved, and
    ERFA regains it’s efficacy! THAT’S IT!

    Reply
  96. Catarina

    Chris,

    Interesting. I remember reading a statement by Henri Knafo some time ago, where he made it clear that Erfa has an obligation to report all formula changes to Health Canada. Since that does not seem to be the case, I can only conclude that whatever changed to make the pills less effective is not the result of a reformulation.

    It is possible that new suppliers of raw material means that the pigs from which the thyroid glands are harvested have been fed something that affects us in a negative way. Or the production methods have changed. It’s obvious that something has changed but, judging from all the messages from the Medical director to patients that I have found online, Erfa is clueless about this…

    Reply
  97. Catarina

    Anne’s question above (why this problematic batch is still circulating in Belgium?) made me wonder if NDT simply stays longer on the pharmacy shelves in Europe, for the simple reason that there are fewer patients on it than in the US and Canada…?

    When I was first put on NDT, in late 2011, I got Armour, and I did great on it for the first six months (15, 30, 60, 90, and 120 mg pills). I could simply not understand what everyone was talking about. Then I refilled my prescription in July 2012, and crashed within a week. I thought the reason was I had been given 240 mg pills (I figured they contain more cellulose than the smaller pills), so I asked for 120 mg pills instead, only to discover that they were not at all effective (compared to the 120 mg pills I had previously taken).

    I have asked many times if it is at all possible that I got the old Armour the first time around, and the answer has always been “no, it’s impossible, the old formula would be long gone from the pharmacy shelves by late 2011”. Yes, in the US and Canada, but what about Europe?! What if the bottles I got had been there since before the 2009 reformulation? They all expired in November or December 2012, so that must mean that old Armour would be good for more than three and a half years after the reformulation…

    I cannot explain it, but I remember feeling better than I had in years on the first bottles of Armour. In the first few weeks on it, I lost almost 5 kilograms (10 pounds) of excess fluid and, after a couple of months on it, people started saying to me that I looked better, that my skin looked brighter, and that I seemed to have lost weight and have more energy and stamina…which was true. I have never felt that good again, not even on Erfa, even though it was an acceptable alternative when Armour stopped working.

    Reply
    • Anne

      I am in the UK but buy privately with the knowledge of my endocrinologist so get mine from the US – sort of – so it’s possible that I got one of the first jars of that batch. I think that UK pharmacies buy in almost as needed. But in Europe, especially Belgium as you have a very knowledgeable doctor in Brussels, I would imagine that they keep stock in, so buy every now and then. In which case it could sit on the shelves for a while. Also I don’t think so many people get the 125mg tablets so they’d hang around for longer. I suppose the expiry dates are long lasting so it shouldn’t matter, but it could also explain why Dr Knafo says so few people have complained.

      Reply
  98. Chris

    Don’t know if Yogi Berra ever said this or not, but he could have:
    “If you don’t look for something, you hardly ever find ‘it’. ”

    Maybe Dr. Knafo should be testing all raw materials (NDT, AND any fillers) for traces of Glyphosate.

    Maybe we all should be tested for traces of Glyphosate.

    Reply
  99. Chris

    Before ‘something’ changed, we (on this blog) all appear to have been satisfied proponents of ERFA – Thyroid. Some participants had also been satisfied proponents of Armour, before it changed. Whatever those changes have been, they have done damage to what had been two fine products.

    While searching for answers, I came across this disturbing paragraph on Wikipedia: (Frankly, the whole article is rather disturbing.)
    “According to the National Pesticide Information Center fact sheet, Glyphosate is not included in compounds tested for by the Food and Drug Administration’s Pesticide Residue Monitoring Program, nor in the United States Department of Agriculture’s Pesticide Data Program. However a field test showed that lettuce, carrots, and barley contained glyphosate residues up to one year after the soil was treated with 3.71 pounds of glyphosate per acre (4.15 kg per hectare).”

    The ERFA/Armour problems maybe caused by something entirely different from any herbicide; but how can we ever find out, if they don’t even look for residues?

    Reply
    • Catarina

      Chris,

      You’re right, it’s really confusing…not to mention frightening. Thanks for this additional piece of info.

      Reply
  100. Nick

    I’ve just had to order some more ERFA through my endo who supplies it through the hospital pharmacy. I rang the pharmacy and asked if I could have batch #LF03508A but they told me that they are not allowed to order a specific batch.

    So it looks like I will have to order some Thryroid-S or put up with feeling like a zombie!

    Reply
    • Anne

      Nick is there any particular reason why you’ve chosen Thyroid-S rather than any of the others?

      Reply
      • Nick

        I’m trying to make a decision based on what I’ve read online Anne. It would appear that I can only get (without prescription) Thyroid-S or Thiroid, and I seen more reports of Thyroid-S working than Thiroid.

        Reply
        • Anne

          I’ve tried both Thiroyd and Thyroid-S recently. I’d say Thyroid-S is the better but in the last week I’ve felt awful and I’m not sure if it’s other things going on or the Thyroid-S. It’s also possible to buy other brands online, my endo will only give me a prescription for Armour, so I buy without prescription. I’m considering WP Thyroid, but if the Thyroid-S is ok then it’s very much cheaper and in the long run I have to think of the cost too. If you want to know the other places to buy the other brands let me know.

          Reply
  101. Ruth Keeme

    Hi I want to know what is this about armour? I take armour and wondering if there was something going on?? Sorry about it being over my head? Thanks so much

    Reply
  102. Sriram Kannan

    I recently switched from eltroxin 50 mg to Erfa natural thyroid 60 mg. I feel really terrible with this tablet. its been two weeks on it. Wondering if i need to switch back to Eltroxin until the Erfa batch issue is resolved. I do not know the lot number but the expiry date is 10/2016

    Does any one have good results with new batch with expiry after 10/2016.

    My blood work were normal on eltroxin with few symptoms and i just wanted to try Erfa but its worst than Eltroxin

    After started reading this forum…should i wait for new Erfa batch to try…local pharmacy does not have stock for 60 mg and 30 mg are available with expiry 10/2016. I was told that new batch will be ordered after Aug.

    Please advise new batch that i should be looking for and if anyone feeling well

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      Sriram, I think any informed thyroid patient will tell you not to go back to Eltroxin alone, but instead, add T3 to your Eltroxin until the day comes that Erfa owns up to the problem and makes the correct change. Or you can explore other brands that other Canadians have gotten of NDT. Also remember that one grain is just a starting dose. You WILL feel worse on one grain if you hold onto it for too long. See http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/natural-thyroid-101

      Reply
      • Sriram Kannan

        Hi Janie,

        Thanks for your reply. With consideration 60 mg of erfa is equivalent to 100 mg of t4 only or 74 mg of t4 only (t3 is four time equivalent to t4) many sites suggest it is 100 mg. Should u think that 60 mg is lower dose and i would have been in a feedback loop ?

        I believe the return of the symptoms is purely due to current issue and not due to the dosage level. Please share your thoughts on it.

        How and where do it get t3 only and how do i calculate the dosage levels. Please advise on it.

        Reply
  103. Sriram Kannan

    I’m new to this site and i made a post already. Forget to ask few more questions.

    since Erfa is now having issue. Should i try Armour ?. I take 50 mg Eltroxin and i wanted to try Natural harmone. Please advise if any existing issues with Armour as Erfa. I stay in Canada and i cannot get to order Armour through doctors. Please suggest if available local in canada.

    Also please advise on switching to Armour and any current similar issues as Erfa. Thanks

    Reply
    • Nick

      Armour worked well for me initially Sriram but after they reformulated it, it didn’t work at all, hence I moved to ERFA. I rather suspect that you will read similar replies.

      Reply
      • Sriram Kannan

        Would someone be able to suggest other best working natural thyroid. I see WP-Thyroid, S-Thyroid. What seems more acceptable with user experience. Since I’m in Canada pharmacy do not sell any other natural thyroid other than Erfa..Please provide some direction.

        Reply
        • Chris

          Sriram, I myself just discovered this web site a week ago, after trying to renew my Erfa Rx. Back when my doctor decided to try me on natural thyroid, I requested Erfa, because it was at a time after the Armour reformulation, and there were a lot of complaints about the new Armour not working as well as the old.

          The following is for information only; it is not an endorsement; but there is a bovine thyroid product being sold in Colorado. I don’t understand how it can be sold OTC w/o a Rx; but in Colorado they already sell things not allowed for sale in other states (if you catch my drift). There is an FDA disclaimer posted on the page, however, drawing attention to it’s presence, could crack down on it’s availability. Hope that doesn’t happen, because I just may decide to try some. Can’t do too much worse than taking something that already isn’t working like it used to.

          The distributor has a Wisconsin address. They also appear to be the manufacturer. Their bovine raw materials come from New Zealand.

          I’m going to ask my local Health Food Store if it is something that they could offer.

          Reply
  104. Nick

    I discovered that in the UK we can report a medicine that appears not to work, to the MHRA. I went to their site but couldn’t find how to complain about a medication, so have written to them for further advice.

    It may be worth all of us in the UK reporting current batches of ERFA as being ineffective.

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      Do understand that with the fact that NDT is an “unapproved drug”, and the fact that the UK medical system is clueless about NDT as a prime treatment, reporting about this may be the worst thing you can do.

      Reply
      • Nick

        I take your point Janie but it could also work both ways.

        Reply
        • Janie Bowthorpe

          No Nick, NDT is considered an “unapproved drug”. By reporting Erfa, the risk can be greater that what they do is not going to help patients at all.

          Reply
          • Nick

            Well, they simply replied that they only deal with drugs manufactured in the UK so wouldn’t be interested in ERFA anyway.

  105. Kathleen McGee

    Thanks for this blog post. I believe that I may have been taking a ‘bad batch’ too. Since March, I’ve gained 15 lbs with no change in my diet, am retaining a lot more water ( a nightmare during heat waves), wake up stiff and sore, and have been needing to sleep an extra hour or two a day.
    So according to folks here. just to make sure I’ve got it straight…
    I should ask the pharmacist if they have any of batch #LF03508A in stock? Is this the only batch that seems to work?
    If the pharmacy has none of the ‘good batch’, perhaps I could try to up my dosage of ERFA? (I’m currently only on 1 grain (60 mg) which now I’m reading is perhaps too low of a dose to begin with?)
    Since I live in Canada, is there a way to get my hands on the other brands of NDT? (besides from Colorado)?

    Thanks for all of your information!! I’m glad at least that there’s a reason for my symptoms.

    Reply
  106. Angie

    One thought I had about the WP. One of the fillers is lactose. I am lactose intolerant and wonder if an inability to digest lactose might be the problem. I may try with some Lact-Aid to see if I can actually (feels like I am taking nothing) take this as an ERFA substitute.

    Reply
  107. Pattycakes

    I started Erfa last summer & was doing pretty well with it until about February. First fatigue, then exhaustion, lack of interest in my usual activites, and headaches, with a continual feeling of a clamp on my head. Ugh. I gained back ten of the fifteen pounds I had previously lost. Several times a day i would have a tightness in my neck/throat area that is difficult to describe & i would feel faint. The worst symptom of all though, were the heart palpitations. It felt like my heart was turning over in my chest. My doctor ordered a Halter monitor then reduced my dosage again from 3.5 to 3gr. Palpitations quieted, but I could barely function.
    Then I found all of you, and realize I am not alone!
    My doctor prescribed WP Thyroid. I knew from the first dose (3gr sublingual, 6am-10am-2pm) that
    Something is not right about that previous batch of Erfa (unknown batch number).
    The only side effect that I have had with WP is an episode of facial flushing 24 hrs after first dose & another episode 48 hours after that. Felt like hot pepper sauce poured on my skin, not like a hot flash & my elbows were red too. Both times I had taken my usual handful of vitamins just before the flush started, so I stopped them & am adding them back, one at a time, Iodoral first.
    When I felt the best on Erfa I was at 3.75gr. (before February).
    I was feeling very hypo after a week on WP at 3gr so 2 days ago I went up to 3.25gr and felt better immediately.
    I have read every single one of these comments! Thanks to everybody for writing.
    This website has helped me SO much. Janie, you convinced me to get off Synthroid after more than 40 years! Truly I feel SO much better than I did taking it. And now you have helped me again with this information about Erfa. Thank you very much.

    Reply
    • Chris

      Patty, you mentioned taking a usual “hand full of vitamins”. By any chance, did you take a larger amount, or a different type of niacin than usual? Niacin flush can cause a very uncomfortable “hot pepper sauce” feel. I have occasionally felt it after taking a B Complex capsule, that previously hadn’t caused problems. Maybe it came from taking it on an empty stomach, while other times it had been taken with enough food to buffer the reaction? The reaction is supposed to be beneficial, but it sure can be scary too, especially if you don’t know to expect it!

      Reply
      • Pattycakes

        Thank you Chris, you are probably exactly right about niacin causing the flushing. I just looked up symptoms & includes flushing of joints. Even though it was only my face & outer elbows, maybe it was caused by my B complex with 100mg of niacin. I have taken it many times before, but……I discontinued it along with the others vits, and added it back in 3 days ago without further flushing.
        When I originally researched thyroid + flushing, all I came up with is medullary thyroid cancer, but does not include joints. So thank you for mentioning this. I will talk it over with my doctor but in the meantime I am very much relieved that it was probably just the niacin!

        Reply
  108. Nick

    Has anybody got any spare Prozac? I’ve just received my next two months supply of ERFA, and it is batch LF03507A despite writing to my endo three times about this issue!

    I guess it is now hello Thyroid-S.

    Reply
    • Anne

      Nick there is one person from Spain on the STTM Canada Facebook page who has batches LF03506A, LF03507A and LF03508A and thinks they all look ok and is getting on ok with the first one, having had a bad batch earlier this year. So it may be worth trying the ones you’ve been given in case they’re ok, because it seems that not all of the same batches are bad, or perhaps it’s that some people are reacting to some batches and some to others.

      Reply
      • Nick

        I’ve been taking the new batch pills since Thursday and feel as bad as ever.

        Reply
  109. Angela

    Great, now Thyroid-S and Thiroyd are both sold out. Now what does one do?

    Reply
    • Nick

      I’ve got an order for Thyroid-S marked as ‘dispatched’ from yesterday.

      Reply
      • Anne

        Nick when you try the Thyroid-S please will you come back and say how you’re getting on. I’ve taking it since mid-June, just small amounts to start with along with some old ERFA, but this last week have had days of exhaustion and waking up shaking with palpitations since taking my whole dose as Thyroid-S. I’m not sure if I need more of it than I did ERFA or less and can’t find anyone else who’s swapped it for ERFA to compare. Thanks.

        Reply
  110. Sandra

    How come I haven’t seen any new comments the past two days, I”m sure people are still talking?

    Reply
  111. Bettina

    I was doing great, feeling healthy and strong for a long time, a month ago I started taking the Canada NT that I had received a month ago (before I was taking Armour that I had from 7 months ago), well, for the past 4 weeks, i have been feeling awful, tired, my thyroid has swollen, i have nausea most of the time and my body aches. Now I hear about other people having problems! I can’t even think straight !

    Reply
  112. Janet Wright

    I am having problems as well and seem to have the same symptoms as Bettina. I am going to try sublingual method. Increase the dose a bit and take it split a.m and p.m.. Also, taking more selenium and including a few drops of iodine. I am hoping this will work. I contacted the company and they are standing firm that there is no difference in the manufacturing process. Go figure. Are we all nuts???

    Reply
  113. Leyna

    Like many of you, I’ve done well with Erfa for many years, and am horrified to learn about the recent problems so many folks are having with it. It’s been a while since I’ve needed to refill my script, but I will soon need to. Can anyone tell me if there have been problems with 30 mg Thyroid tablets?? If so, are there specific batch #’s or expir. dates I should try to GET or AVOID? Last but not least, I live in the US and have ordered directly from Erfa in the past, but more recently, through Canadadrugs.com. Has anyone had luck requesting specific batches or expir. dates when ordering online? If so is there an online company that has been sympathetic or at least accomodating re checking the batch no/expir. dates ahead of the sale? Deepest thanks in advance to anyone who can advise me regarding 30 mg tablets. Thank you!!!!

    Reply
    • Nick

      I have a batch of LF03508A 30mg tablets and they are NOT working.

      Reply
      • Lori T

        Leyna I have a bottle of LF03508A 30mg tablets, expiry 02/2017, and they ARE working. I am wondering if Nicks expiry date is different? Could batch numbers be the same for different dates? My bottle also says Montreal Canada on it. Could this make a difference too? Geez how confusing!!

        Reply
      • Angie

        Nick..I have this same batch..and with years of experience, I can’t tell you if it’s working or not. I feel hypo and then alternatively hyper. I have some weak shakiness and feeling like I just can not deal with stress on this new batch..at ALL. HR a little higher than usual and temps lower. Also a recurring UTI and a little weight gain.

        Reply
  114. ShayFL

    I have about 6 unopened bottles and some are the so called “bad” batches and I’ve opened them and they look exactly the same as the ones I am taking now which are the “old” bottles. Not shiny…no discoloration. No deeper indentions. Hoping the are ok!

    Reply
  115. Chris

    No Janet, we are not all nuts. There is definitely a problem somewhere, and I am leaning towards that problem being with what is being fed to the pigs on which we rely.

    Yesterday, an online news site included an article with a direct accusation as to the cause of birth defects identified by one Danish pig farmer named Ib Borup Pedersen. That article identified one particular chemical manufacturer; but ever since their patent expired, they are no longer the sole producer of that herbicide which happens to be an endocrine disruptor. Different companies combine glyphosate with different adjuvants (substances that intensify an effect), some of which can apparently be even worse than the glyphosate itself.

    Twenty years ago, I remember the Danish countryside being covered with bright yellow fields of a crop that I was told would be dried and used for Winter fodder. Now, several Western hemisphere countries are apparently major sources of GMO soy animal feed that is shipped to Europe. Naively, I did not suspect that EU attitudes against GMOs did not extend to feed for their farm animals!

    When I suggested that it would be nice if ERFA purchased their raw materials from Denmark, rather than from where ever they had been getting them, little did I realize how wide spread the potential problem was.
    “GM soy linked to health damage in pigs – a Danish Dossier”
    When farmer Pedersen ran out of feed, he had purchased some imported GMO feed, and shortly ran into all sorts of problems with his herd. He switched back to non-GMO feed without saying anything to his farm hand. Within days, his farm hand noticed an improvement.

    “Danish Whistle-blowers Reveal Links between GM soy, Roundup and Health Damage in Pig Herd”
    It is quite possible that Dr. Knafo has made absolutely no changes in the production of ERFA; but that an increasing number of farmers, have changed their pigs’ feed.

    I’m still leaning towards trying some of that NZ bovine thyroid glandular product, “nutri-pak THYROID”, by way of Colorado.
    The title of this article from NZ, lends support to my decision: “GE animal feed? No thanks! ”

    Reply
    • Sandra

      Wow Chris,
      That is amazing and very scarey information for if this is the case then what options does that leave us. It would be interesting to find out, for all the other dessicated products that continue to work for people, where do they get there material from. I remember specifically my pharmacy telling me that back when it was on back order for the first time that they were told by Erfa that they had changed their supplier. They can say it isn’t so but why would a pharmacist make that up?

      Reply
      • Chris

        Sandra, between the farmer and pharmacist; there are two interim levels of “supplier”. ERFA’s processor is now in Spain, instead of Belgium. But from where is their processor getting the raw materials??? If ERFA changed supplier just for the sake of price, then sadly, they have “sold-out” their reputation, and our source for a product we have come to rely on. That ultimately can’t be good for their bottom line.

        I highly recommend this YouTube video that I discovered this morning, which is sort of a debate between a self assured CBC TV ‘personality’ named Kevin O’Leary, and a very astute fourteen year old advocate for GMO labeling. It is titled: “Rachel Parent debates GMO’s (vs) Kevin O’Leary on CBC’s Lang & O’Leary Exchange”. (Either use your search engine to find it, or type in the usual www. then copy, cut, & paste: youtube.com/watch?v=TX_-Zoom9Uc The format of this blog does not allow for the posting of URL links.)

        Reply
  116. Sarah

    I would very much like to hear from those of you who have switched to WP THYROID because of the ERFA problem. I have just started taking it. How are you doing on it?

    Reply
    • Pattycakes

      After 17 days on WP, I am still feeling good most of the time. My mood & focus are stabilizing. I have lost one pound, no headaches, less pain in joints, only a few almost imperceptible palpitations, nothing like the horrible ones I was having with ERFA. I have not had any more flushing, as I noted in my first rambling posting of Aug 5. My focus seems much better now. This past week I have even started reorganizing my art supplies & started a new project!
      I wonder if the flushing I had was from the sudden uptake of T3 when I switched from ERFA to WP?

      Reply
      • Sarah

        Hello Pattycakes,
        That sounds like really great positive steps forward. Also sounds as though you are becoming creative again which must be a huge relief for you. Thank you for replying…..it gives me hope too. Hope you continue to improve and that your your health returns.x

        Reply
  117. Leyna

    Thank you Nick for sharing your 30 mg batch number of Erfa Thyroid with me. Can anyone else advise me of bad batch numbers of 30 mg Erfa Thyroid pills, or, any GOOD batch numbers of 30 mg pills ? Are the problems occuring for users of 60 mg pills, or are other 30 mg pill users experiencing problems? Thank you for your help, I am grateful for it!

    Reply
    • Angela

      Hi Leyna,
      I have been on LF03506A 30 mg for a couple of weeks now and am struggling. In my opinion this batch is not good.

      Reply
      • Anne

        This is so strange because someone in Spain has said that batch is ok for her. Someone here has also said that the batch I have (13C06, 125mg x 500) is fine for him. It seems to me that the entire batches aren’t a problem but that something has happened to some of them. On a different forum someone has mentioned that they have bought WP Thyroid but it has no potency due to being heat damaged during transport and that this problem is known about. I am hoping to get the link about the problem soon, because I have been buying first Armour, then Naturethroid and then ERFA for years and never had a problem due to transport to me.

        Reply
        • Angie

          Anne…I have just finished a batch of WP that I did OK on as long as I included some “Lact-Aid” (just nibbled a little with each dose). However a 2nd batch of WP is really causing me issues. Agitation, fatigue…similar to the bad batch ERFA issues. When you find that link, please let me know..in the meantime, it may be back to Nature-throid.

          Reply
          • Anne

            Hi Angie, this is the link which I was sent by a person who is also having problems with WP:
            http://thyroid.about.com/od/thyroiddrugstreatments/a/drugsinsummer.htm
            Soon there won’t be anything left to try 🙁 oh and I still haven’t heard back from Dr Knafo of course. I seem to be ok on Thyroid-s, had a few shaky days last week, but perhaps it’s ok after all. I know several people taking it with no problem, but I don’t like the list of fillers and wish Thiroyd had worked for me instead. I may give it another try actually.

    • Anne

      Leyna I have asked Dr Kanfo if he could let me know the batch numbers of any ERFA which no-one has complained about. I don’t know if I will get a response though. Meanwhile I have been told that the following are ok BN136051 expiry 07 2016 60mgs and
      LF03140B expiry 10/2016 60mgs, however I don’t have them and haven’t tried them unfortunately.

      Reply
      • Angie

        Hello again, Anne. I responded at great length to Dr. Knafo sometime ago, again requested the results of the investigation, and have not received a response.

        Reply
  118. Emmy

    I started WP Throid and am feeling bad. It does not do sublingual as well as Erfa. My FT3 & FT4 are both very bottom of the range and my TSH has risen. I had labs June 30 knowing I was switching from ERFA since it was having problems and then again on July 7 as I was feel so bad after only 2 weeks on it. Any suggestions? Should I raise the WP Throid (taking 65 mcg & 12.5-25mcgof cytomel currently). I was on 60 ERFA & 12.5-25mcg of cytomel before.

    Reply
  119. Anne

    Can I ask what symptoms people are having on the ERFA which is causing problems? Is it a gradual decline into feeling hypo or is a sudden reaction? I got immediate stomach upsets and didn’t continue taking it, kept to an old batch, gradually substituted some Thyroid-S until I was taking only Thyroid-S. But now I’ve had one day of complete exhaustion and today woke up shaking with palpitations, which can only be caused by the Thyroid-S. I still feel awful and don’t know what to try any more, nothing seems to suit everyone who used to get on with ERFA and I’m wondering if taking some of the new ERFA might be better than how I feel at the moment..

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      Anne, there appears to be outright something wrong with Erfa now.

      BUT…..you also have to distinguish if what you are going through is just from Erfa now being bad, or that desiccated thyroid (NDT) is revealing that you now have either low iron or cortisol, which NDT will reveal. So if you have had complete exhaustion also on Thyroid-S, that tells you that you either aren’t raising high enough, or you do have either an iron or cortisol problem which it’s revealing. You need to read http://www.stopthethyroidimadness.com/ndt-doesnt-work-for-me

      Reply
      • Anne

        Thanks Janey but I’ve had a lot of tests recently and my iron is apparently fine – 111.5 (60-180), ferritin 143.4 (10-291) both in April – and serum cortisol last November was 425 nmol/L at 8.45am no range given, but a recent saliva test also showed it as fine (I took hydrocortisone for some years but am now treated by a medical herbalist and adrenals seem to have been coping for a long time). I’ve been taking NDT for years, first Armour until it reformulated, then Naturethroid until it too reformulated then ERFA and was doing very well on it and am still ok on an older batch of ERFA, so I know that NDTs suit me normally. I have just a few tablets left of an old batch of ERFA and took 1 grain today (usual dose is 2.5 grains but I’m worried about running out) instead of taking any more of the Thyroid-S because I felt so awful.

        You say that there’s now an outright problem with ERFA, is anyone getting anywhere with the company? Dr Knafo emailed me recently to ask how I was doing which I thought odd, but presumably it’s his way of monitoring those who’ve complained. I’ve asked him if there are any batches which no-one has complained about but not had a reply yet. I’d give anything to get a good batch of ERFA again! Meanwhile I think I’ll order some WP and hope it’s ok. Someone has reported that their batch of that was ’empty’ due to heat during transport which is worrying, and it contains lactose which i avoid, but there’s not much choice left now.

        Reply
        • Janie Bowthorpe

          Your ferritin reveals you have inflammation which needs treatment! Astaxanthin and Curcumin help, daily, until you fix this.

          You can’t go by serum cortisol. It’s measuring both unbound and bound and doesn’t give an accurate idea. You need to redo saliva.

          No, no one is getting anywhere with the company. They continue to act like it’s not their pills and you guys are the problem. Sad.

          Reply
          • Anne

            Thanks Janey and sorry if I’m being dense, but how does that ferritin result show inflammation? I thought it was good because years ago it was down to 7 and my GP told me it was fine then I read it had to be over 75. Also what sort of inflammation?

            The latest salivary cortisol test I had done was four weeks ago and the results were 9am 18.9 (12-22), midday 9 (5 – 9), afternoon 4.1 (3-7) and night 0.9 (1-3). DHEA ratio came back 0.16 (0.1-0.5). The alternative doc who arranged them said my DHEA could do with boosting but cortisol was fine.

            I don’t think the problem can be a reformulation of ERFA, the batches involved are so random and some people are fine others not, also some batches are ok packed in 100s but not packed in 500s. I wish they’d stop blaming us and I could back to feeling normal, or else know what else to try which would be similar.

          • Janie Bowthorpe

            Anne, when you have inflammation, your body automatically thrusts iron into storage to stop the iron from feeding the inflammation and making it worse. Any kind of inflammation will do this.

            Your morning is actually just ‘slightly’ too low, though not yet considered “low cortisol”. People with healthy morning cortisol are usually at the tip top, like 22 or 21. Noon is too high. Afternoon is too low–definitely low cortisol there. You have a stress response, showing your adrenals are taking a hit and need support, like high dose Vit. C, b-vitamins, and herbal support.

  120. Anne

    Thanks you for your help Janey, I thought my ferritin was good a last but I’ll try to sort it out and also start treating my adrenals again. I think the Thyroid-S must be weaker than ERFA and that’s why I got this reaction because it only began when I took my whole dose as Thyroid-S, not while I was still substituting bits of ERFA. Hopefully when Nick tries his he’ll come back and say if he needs more than he did ERFA or less.

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      For what it’s worth, Anne, people don’t get the palps and shakiness you describe just from being on a low dose. Those are usually associated with either an iron or cortisol problem….

      Reply
      • Anne

        Thanks Janey but this is curious, because I didn’t have either of those on the old ERFA which I was taking bits of up until last week, only three days after switching entirely to Thyroid-S. From the two reasons cortisol is the most likely going by past experience, so I shall do something about it again.

        Reply
        • Janie Bowthorpe

          I believe you, but that doesn’t mean that Thyroid-S isn’t revealing the cortisol or iron problem now. It could be that the bad batches of Erfa didn’t have enough thyroid hormones in them (or they were blocked, or they were weakened) to cause what Thyroid-S is revealing to you.

          Reply
          • Anne

            Ah, hadn’t thought of that! Ok so more to think about and sort out, thanks for your help!

          • Anne

            Actually this brings two further questions up, but I feel I’m taking over this thread, is there anywhere else I can ask them such as facebook etc?

          • Angie

            Janie: I’m with Anne on this one. I have not taken any Thyroid-S, but have tried a new batch of ERFA that I feel better on, but weak and shaky after a couple days in. I also have a UTI that seems to be tied to use of this batch, but am not completely sure yet. I do not have problems on the older ERFA batches or the bad ERFA batches..Nor have I had issues on N-T or WP until a batch I opened day before yesterday..Have a physical coming up and a spare cortisol kit, so can certainly check on iron and cortisol status, but seem to have issues only on certain batches.
            Are we starting to see issues with other porcine thyroid replacements as well? We need to monitor this because I have NEVER had such problems with NDT. Something seems to definitely be going on.

          • Anne

            Thanks Janie, now done, also apologies for mis-spelling your name for days!

  121. Elysha

    Hi Janie, thanks for this post. I actually never knew I was taking Erfa or what it was even though I’ve been on this medication for 8 years or so, because I got my pills from Shoppers Drug Mart and they take them out of the manufacturer bottle and put them in a blank bottle with their own label. This time, they ran out and I had to go to Safeway, and put two and two together. I have been feeling awful.
    Is there a master list of bad batches somewhere? I”m about to try this new one that I just got. I’d love to know which ones people are reporting, I see a few in the comments but no concise list.

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      No master list. But if you or someone could write down all the batches mentioned for me in the comments in this string, and include whether the person is doing well on each batch or not, I can post it. And you would get a CYBER GOLD STAR for doing it!!

      Reply
  122. Ren Gron

    It’s been a while, is there any new correspondence from the manufacturers of Erfa?

    Reply
  123. Kelly

    Hello all,
    I just can’t understand what I’m reading here.
    I’ve been on Thyroid for 3 years now (so before and after the change of supplier) and everything is ok for me…
    Yes I’ve noticed the change in the design of the bottle and the pills. It surprised me at first and I called Erfa to know if I had to change my dosage.
    I trusted them when they said that the formulation was exactly the same.
    Erfa changed my life and I’m still more than happy with my medication.

    I don’t know if you’ll post my message but it was important for me to report my experience.

    Reply
    • shirley

      So Kelly, for the last 7 months or so have you been using any of the lot numbers, noted on this site, that others have been experiencing difficulty with? Thanks for the clarification.

      Reply
    • Anne

      It’s good to know of people who aren’t affected by this, please could you let us know the batch number, expiry date and dose of your tablets of ERFA Thyroid and also what country you are in? Thanks 🙂

      The majority of people must be doing well on it otherwise we’d be hearing more about it, but some people are reporting a batch is good when others are having problems with the same batch, so it has become very confusing and may not mean there’s a problem with the manufacture.

      Reply
      • Kelly

        Hi Shirley,
        Now I’m on Thyroid 60mg LFO3139A (expiration 2016)
        I’m sure that I’ve bought some of the ones mentioned but to be honest I don’t have them anymore since I was okay with them :s Sorry
        I live in Canada Anne 🙂 I hope it will help
        From now on I’ll keep my bottles so I’ll be able to be more precise next time…

        Reply
        • Anne

          Hi Kelly,
          Thanks for letting me know your batch number. I’ve just done a general internet search, then searched on about 6 specific sites I know of where people have recorded their problems with ERFA, and that batch number only appears once, in a post on Janie’s first blog about this, asking if it’s ok. So it looks as if this batch can be assumed to be ok for the moment. The only hesitation I have is that the previous three consecutive batches (LF03136/7/8A) are fine according to some people but not according to others. It’s a puzzle!

          Reply
          • Kelly

            Yes it seems complicated. :s. I can live again thanks to Erfa and I really wish that it will suit you again soon 🙂

  124. Nick

    While researching the subject of B12 deficiency, I came across a symptom that is not often listed. Apparently a shortage of B12 means that the body does not utilize hormones efficiently.

    I know that I am short of B12, and I’m one who has not done well on EFRA since around February this year. Could that be the factor that makes the difference between those of us with a problem with certain thyroid medications, and those who don’t?

    I’m just off for a blood test requested by the hypertension nurse at my local medical centre. I am praying that something shows up on that re the B12 situation as I have not taken my supplement for a couple of months now.

    Reply
  125. Shauna

    For the first time, I received my ERFA thyroid in the weird looking bottle; I was fairly stable on 2.5 grains (dr. made me lower b/c of high FT3 and unmeasurable TSH) and since starting on the new bottle, my joints are so achy, I am retaining water like crazy – sleep all off — hot flashes — I do have low cortisol. I have cortef, which I took, but after a few weeks, is when I started to ache, like cramping in my feet and pain in my wrists — made me feel really hypo again, so I stopped. I think I had low potassium and maybe the cortef made it worse? All I know now is that I feel SO hypo, carpal tunnel, fluid retention blah — I am SO sick of feeling like shit…sorry, but need some help. Don’t know what to switch to — I have some Thyro-Gold, maybe a trial to see if I feel better?
    Thanks.

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      FYI Shauna: Informed patients stopped letting their doctors lower their meds due to a suppressed TSH. That is normal when optimal on NDT!

      But as far as Erfa, each patient has to make sure they don’t confuse the symptoms of low cortisol with a potential bad batch of Erfa. i.e. those are two different things. If you have low cortisol as proven by a 24 hour adrenal cortisol test, you’ll have problems raising any NDT, including Thyro-Gold.

      Finally, there is a particular method to using Cortef (if you needed it). It’s explained in Chapter 6 in the revised STTM book.

      Reply
  126. cjean

    What are people finding that satisfactorily is replacing Erfa?

    Reply
    • Sarah

      Hi cjean
      I’ve replaced my erfa with WP thyroid. It’s early days yet and I’m nowhere near stable because I literally had to start again from square one but so far I’m tolerating it. No nasty reaction. Just raising slowly.

      Reply
  127. Nick

    I received my Thyroid-S this morning (absolutely excellent service) and will report back here when I have had sufficient time to assess it.

    Has anybody tried taking it sublingually?

    Reply
    • Anne

      Nick I chew my Thyroid-S thoroughly then swallow whatever is left, because it has a hard coating supposed to keep it intact until the large intestine or something like that. I also take 2.5 grains so split one tablet and checked with others first that you could do this. Some people seem to swallow and some chew and then do sublingual. Please let me know if you think you need more or less than you took of ERFA to feel the same, thanks.

      Reply
      • Nick

        Thanks Anne, I’ll try sublingual.

        It’s still only a few days so I am still assessing how I am doing on Thyroid-S. I do feel slightly better already though – a bit ‘brighter’. I am taking the same dose as my ERFA, ie 2 tablets per day, and will experiment to see what works best.

        Reply
        • Angela

          Hi Nick,
          I was wondering how you are doing now that some time has passed with you being on Thyroid-S?
          I have been off on vacation this week and it has been a write off for me which is so sad as I truly look forward to my time off to get so much done (sounds countertproductive I know, but I’m a dooer kind of personality who thrives on checking off the to do list). I finally received my Thyroid-S in the mail and before I started it wondered how you are doing. I have three days of vaca left and even though I have been feeling less than great before taking my vacation, I cannot afford to feel worse than I do as I will need to be back at work Tuesday.

          Reply
  128. John

    new here, just checking out the site. heres another thought… didnt see it mentioned anywhere. if some are having problems, others not, as well as some noting a changed pill look and others not…. i have read lately about counterfeit meds finding their way into legitimate pharmacies. the counterfeits often look remarkable similar to the real thing, identical packaging etc. they can be sugar pills or sometimes contain less active ingredient. if someone in the supply chain did a swap on a couple boxes somewhere this would also explain alot (including why ERFA testing came out ok).

    might also be real interesting if only certain cities are involved. (which could also indicate heat damage etc)

    Reply
    • Anne

      John I have wondered about counterfeit ERFA but when I raised my concern with Dr Knafo and offered to send him some of my tablets for analysis I didn’t get an answer. I’m amazed that he hasn’t agreed to analyse the actual tablets people are complaining about, rather than the stocks they still have of the same batches.

      Reply
      • John

        i agree with you. to check out some of the “problem” pills would be good. also, to not do so could end up being a huge marketing faux pas for them.

        it would do several things.1. it would demonstrate to their customers they are interested in resolving any problems rather than saving the money needed to investigate/fix them. 2. if turns out to be counterfeit, heat damage etc this would prove its not a manufacturing problem (and they didnt lie to us saying that its not) and the product is still a good one to use. 3. if never resolved, when all future potential customers read thru these internet posts researching ERFA, they’ll be left wondering…. when is the next time the rug is going to be pulled out from under me? why use a treatment if it may change and leave me with nothing?. 4. on the other hand, if they were to have 20 or 30 customers send in some old “good” pills and some new “problem” pills and have them checked…at least they could report this to everyone to show theyre not just sticking their heads into the sand.

        on the other hand, it may be a real problem for the company if regulators find out, so they may just be trying to keep things quiet and hoping it all goes away.

        i suspect the preference of everyone on this list would be if there was a temporary glitch to get it fixed because alot of folks seem to like this product.

        Reply
  129. Annie

    After years of lack of understanding about what was going on with me, I’ve just been diagnosed with hypothyroidism.
    I need advices because as a matter of fact one of my friends has got hypothyroidism to and she’s having Erfa medication. It seems to work with her so I wanted to test this one to. But then I discovered you blog..
    Is there any one here who is happy with Erfa?
    It’s all new for me and I see so many bad comments while my friend is feeling so well with Erfa…
    Thanks for your help

    Reply
  130. Sarah

    My problem is that I feel I can’t trust ERFA anymore. I felt as though my stomach was on fire. The whole of my insides seemed to burn. I tried raising but just got horrible headaches and looked and felt awful.
    I’m sticking with WP thyroid for the tine being and raising slowly. I miss ERFA so much but just can’t trust it. At least with WP Thyroid I know it’s coming from a manufacturer who has never had their NDT’s recalled which makes me feel safe.

    Reply
  131. Tamara

    I switched from ERFA back in the early Winter to WP thyroid, and immediately went hypo as my latest labs showed. I’m wondering if the issue with WP thyroid went back that far. I’m now on Thyroid-S, and was one of the “lucky” ones who got an order in for it before they ran out that should do me a while.
    Someone above mentioned the GMO link. I actually thought of that myself a few days ago. Which country that makes NDT uses non-GMO feed? I’m going to look into this company myself in Colorado that is making NDT with non-GMO feed.
    Is there any update on ERFA yet?

    Reply
    • Chris

      Tamara, Last Monday, I ordered a bottle of that New Zealend, non GMO certified, bovine (cow) sourced thyroid that I mentioned awhile back. In searching for the product name”Nutri-Pak”, I discovered four mail order sources in the US that sell it. They are located in: Kelso WA, Boulder CO, Wautoma WI, and Elmwood Park, IL. That last source is part of a chain called “Fruitful Yield Health Foods”, which lists at least ten “brick and mortar” stores in Illinois.

      The Kelso, WA site from which I ordered, offers a basic shipping and handling rate of $4.99 (inside the US) via USPS, and advertises a 3 – 8 day delivery. (I received my shipment in 3 days!) http://nutripakonline.com/Contact-Info.html . Online tracking of the shipment was also available. The box in which it was sent could hold as many as 4 such bottles. Don’t know to what amount that would influence postage. Even if they charged $4.99 for each bottle, I think it would still compare favorably (costwise) to Erfa, mg for mg.

      Since Friday, I have been slowly adjusting doses, and evaluating the effects. The tablets are only offered in 130 mg. So far, I have worked up to 1 1/2 tablets/day, in divided doses, and closely watching my temps and pulse rate. I am feeling a little better than I had been on 120 mg of Erfa, but there is still room for improvement.

      The taste is not objectionable, however, the texture is terribly gritty. It does not lend itself to being taken sublingualy.

      On one of the web sites (along with a surprising variety of “glandulars”), Nutri-Pak also offered thyroid capsules in either bovine or porcine.

      Reply
  132. waveylines

    A little update -i have been taking WP Thyroid for 6 weeks now and am feeling much much better -it has taken me ages to get over from taking Erfa as I ended up being so poorly and had to take over 5 weeks off work plus a month of holiday! Interestingly enough now I am stable on WP am noticing that i can take a much lower dose -a whole grain and more, less! Erfa was not working in my system and I did feel like i wasn’t taking anything but just going downhill -very scary. My endocrinologist felt the meds were not being absorbed into the cells because my blood tests were still in range (but lower then before) but i was showing signs and symptoms of classic hypothyroidism -it was felt Erfa was back-stacking in my blood. i can therefore only assume that something was preventing my body from absorbing it…..strange after being so well on it for over two years! -.hope you are listening Dr Knafo!
    I still have a lot of weight to shift that I have put on in recent months but am no longer gaining and have lost a little bit – at least am now beginning to feel well enough to consider setting up a walking and low grade exercise programme.

    The one thing i have noticed with WP is that storage is important -it needs to be kept in it’s bottles with the little sachet to keep it dry or it goes sticky…..so during the day I use one of the old bottles with the sachet still in it to transport my daytime dose. This works well…The rest i have stored in the fridge as we have just had a heatwave here in the UK….

    Janie have you heard anything more from Dr Knafo?

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      No, I haven’t heard any more than any of you have from Dr. Knafo. i.e. Erfa is stone-walling and refusing to admit that something has been seriously wrong with Erfa.

      Reply
    • Nick

      I’m now starting to feel a slight improvement after a few days on Thyroid-S.

      Yesterday I received my blood test results (blood taken prior to starting on Thyroid-S, ie while taking ERFA) and the thyroid results were fine. So while I have been feeling terrible on ERFA, it does seem have been doing something as regards blood test results. I had the same experience when they changed Armour, my test results were fine but it obviously wasn’t working as regards making me well.

      I hope that I’m wrong but I can’t help thinking that this situation with ERFA is all too like what happened with Armour after the FDA got involved with it.

      Reply
      • Angela

        Hi Nick,
        I too have ordered Thyroid-S and am very hopeful now that I hear your news. Thank you for letting us all know how you are doing. Unfortunately when they ship to Canada, there is no way to track it and I am left guessing when it will arrive, anywhere from 10-25 business days!!!! So long to wait when one is not well.
        In the meantime I have had to fill a new prescription of Erfa and it is not the same as my old batch and when I got home opened the bottle to see what it looked like and found there is absolutely no smell to the new pills. The old pills, about 15 of them have a strong smell but nothing for 350 new pills. How the heck can this be if there is “nothing different”?
        Its all B.S.!!!

        Reply
      • Anne

        Nick it’s very interesting that your blood test results were the same as usual on your latest ERFA. This can only mean that the hormone content is the same but that something else in the tablets has caused some of us to react. I didn’t take mine for long enough to find out what would happen, the first three days of stomach issues were enough for me! I’ve also noticed on the FTPO Canada Facebook group that the majority of people in the Eastern part of Canada are still doing fine on ERFA, but not some of those in the Western part. On the FTPO International and Europe groups a lot of people in the US and Europe have had a problem. So it could also be some ingredient damaged in storage, by heat or some other damage during transit.

        Reply
        • Dianne

          Anne, I’m in Eastern Canada, and as you know, I didn’t do well (understatement!) on the new ERFA. I don’t know if we can find any clear pattern to this. I agree that it’s more likely a problem with ‘other’ ingredient(s) in the tablets. Like you, I had a severe and immediate reaction.

          Reply
        • Angie

          I have had problems on both the early 2014 batches AND the batch that some seemed to do well on, LFO3508A. I get twitchy, feel like nerve endings are raw, have palpitations and eventually feel week and shaky…Do not seem to absorb the WP hardly at all…not sure why…someone mentioned some WP batches being heat damaged…would like to know where I can find more info. I too have had “normal” labs on the early 2014 ERFA, but something else not right. ERFA/Knafo have not answered my questions reqarding other ingredients OR my requests to see the results of the supposed “investigation” they performed.. I agree that this a problem with a change in the other Ingredients…really no other assumption to make.

          Reply
  133. Chris

    Janie, I would appreciate your thoughts about these 24 hr. cortisol scores.
    02:15 am – 4.1 ; 07:55 am – 6.1 ; 14:15 pm – 1.5 ; 20:59 pm – 0.8 Thank you.

    The ‘chart’ that the lab’s computer generates appears to assume that everyone’s day begins, and cortisol peaks, around 6:00 am. Using that interpretation, my first three scores line up a little below the low-normal line. However, the fourth dot shown at 02:15 am, is way off the chart, showing about five times what a low-normal score would be for someone ‘normally’ awakening around 06:00 am. But, if the reference range curves were to be shifted to the left by about four hours (to better match my sleep/wake cycle), then my scores would appear to all line up near ‘high normal’ or maybe even at the ‘high’ line.

    Talk about confusing! I’m not sure if I should be considering adaptogens for low cortisol, or magnolia bark for high cortisol. My doctor didn’t comment on this disparity, and was appeared focused on a different issue.

    My Ferritin also runs high, for which I am planning to start donating blood (as advised by “Health Journalist” Bill Sardi. – Those interested in lowering their own potential for “rusting”, can check out this “Have A Heart Health Radio” archived internet radio program from 06/08/2014. Bill’s advice about ferritin starts a little after the 10:30 minute mark. http://billsardihealthandwealthshow.com/2014/06/ Admittedly, there are a couple products that the program pitches, but each first half hour, in general, is devoted to nutrition and debunking some of the missteps of so called “modern” medicine. )

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      Chris, high ferritin is NOT a reason to give blood!!! High ferritin is from inflammation that needs treatment. It’s hemochromatosis that needs blood donations, and hemochromatosis makes all your iron labs high, not just ferritin. Also, you didn’t give ranges, so it’s hard to comment. But compare what we have learned here: http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/lab-values Your wakeup morning cortisol, which I’m assuming 7:55 is, should be at the tip top of the range, for example. I’m thinking yours is not. So that’s low cortisol i.e not hemachromatosis and blood donations.

      Reply
      • Chris

        Thank you, Janie, but 7:55 was an erroneous assumption. My first saliva was collected after awakening at 02:15 am.
        Here again are the numbers, along with ZRT’s stated “reference ranges”:
        02:15 am – 4.1 – r.r. 3.7 – 9.5 (First saliva collected after awakening)
        07:55 am – 6.1 – r.r. 3.7 – 9.5 (The same r.r. is given; as both are registered by the lab as “Morning” scores)
        14:15 pm – 1.5 – r.r. 0.6 – 1.9
        20:50 pm – 0.8 – r.r. 0.4 – 1.0
        Not everyone’s life runs on the same schedule.

        Do different labs, running the same tests, actually get completely different numbers? I have heard said that labs typically throw out the top and bottom %5 of all scores, and the remaining 90% represents THEIR particular “reference range”… over the last X# of tests. But subject to change… over the next X# of tests.

        Re: iron… Women loose their cardiovascular risk advantage over men, when they reach menopause and iron starts building up, instead of being lost each month. Think of blood donation as exerting a little influence over ‘Mother Nature’, and ‘Father Time’.

        Reply
        • Janie Bowthorpe

          If you wake up for your “morning wakeup” every morning around 2:15 am (i.e. you go to bed for the “evening” far earlier than the rest of us, or have a work schedule that means you have to wake up far earlier), that should be at the tip top of the range. i.e. 2:15 is your 8 am.

          Reply
  134. Gina

    I have been taking the new ERFA pills for about 3 weeks. My hair has been falling out, my wrists hurt, I am very bloated and have terrible brain fog.
    Batch #LF03727A
    Exp 04/2017
    Why would ERFA do this to so many patients?! I just don’t understand

    Reply
  135. Gina

    The brain fog is so bad I forgot to mention the exhaustion!! Dry itchy skin and my hair is also feeling like hay 😞

    Reply
  136. Sandra

    Gina,
    In a nutshell, the quality of our lives is once again being ruined. We have no choice but to try another product which I urge you to do before this goes on too long for you. The longer you wait, the longer it takes to reverse all that the hypo state does to ones health so perhaps read all the messages here and see which other dessicated thyroid product will be worth trying.
    Good luck.

    Reply
  137. Sandra

    I’m curious and would love to hear from those of us who have been greatly affected, are your symptoms constant each and every day progessively getting worse or do you have days where you may be bit better but overall the decline increases every time you do have a worse day?

    Reply
  138. CNY

    Hi -I read through the posts here about this issue with EFRA. While I appreciate how devastating this has been,
    as I went through the reformulation with Armour (it didn’t work anymore for me either), alright already!
    It’s settled — the stuff doesn’t work anymore. They aren’t going to fix it, just as Forest Labs didn’t.
    Now Let’s move on and make a positive step forward to find out what does work.

    Furthermore, here’s my suggestion for TRYING to stop this from ever happening again.
    I’m hearing here thyroid S and WP are both possibilities, yes? Then maybe once we see what works best
    we collectively get involved – almost like a union (or like a costco) – and communicate with the manufacturer
    telling them we will be purchasing their product and want to be involved or informed with all changes having to do
    with reformulation or manufacturing facilities, etc. Even better we say collectively we won’t continue to purchase their
    product unless we are asked about any changes – I’m just throwing it out there. Basically, what we’d be doing is saying
    we’ll bring you business, the same way the docs do. Moreover, we can write a letter almost like a petition and get count on STTM
    followers, have Janie sign it representing us. As for ERFA, we can send a similar letter to them and say we will no longer be
    purchasing or recommending your product– also giving them the numbers of people we are talking about. Who knows- maybe the dopes
    reach out to us.

    There’s strength in numbers…

    Reply
    • Anne

      I think this is a good idea in theory CNY, but am not convinced that the manufacturers really care about our opinion. It would be good though to have advance warning of any changes.
      I do think it would be good to have somewhere for people to say how the different brands suited them and to compare them all. I’ve found it confusing to have to decide because of the differing comments about each brand – and just when I’d decided to try WP I was contacted by someone who had a batch of that which was damaged in transit. Best of all would be to pool brands and each try each one, that might lead to some sort of consensus but would be impractical to carry out.
      As far as ERFA is concerned it seems that they only received a small number of complaints compared with their overall distribution, that the majority were not from Canada (or not the area of Canada where they are based) and that they weren’t concerned because of this. The worst scenario is that their customer base reduces, they can’t cover the cost of the new ‘facility’ so they stop making it altogether. I still don’t think they’d care about our opinion or how many of us this has affected, but it would give some satisfaction to send the letter you suggest!

      Reply
  139. Pattycakes

    I wonder if all these various pill makers do their own desiccation? Probably not.

    If the desiccated gland used to make the pills is sourced from more than one supplier, perhaps there is some variation in the processing that is destroying the effectiveness of some of the product. This could account for the fact that some batches are good.

    When baking at home, its SO easy to leave the cookies in the oven just a little too long….

    I have an old bottle with a few unused pieces of good Erfa from Oct2013. It smells VERY different from the Feb2014 bottle that caused such awful side effects for me. Sorry no batch numbers on those, the pharmacy said they don’t keep records of batch numbers, which I find hard to believe.

    Even though I had just received a new shipment of #800 Erfa, I decided not to take a chance. I chose to switch to WP for 2 reasons: low number of fillers, & my compounding pharmacist told me that RLC has tighter controls on the amounts of active ingredients.

    It’s been just over 5 weeks now. So far I am still feeling much better than I did on that last batch of Erfa.

    Reply
  140. Elizabeth Brideau

    Hello. I’ve been on Erfa for a little over 6 months now. I’m taking 90mg Erfa, and 1/2 of a 75mcg Synthroid daily.
    I’ve been reading the posts, but I can’t find where you are finding your lot numbers. Do I have to ask my Pharmacist for this info?
    Thank you.

    Reply
  141. Anna

    I was on 8 grains of Erfa (4 x 125 mg daily) and both FTs came back low (FT4 1 (ref 0.7-1.7), FT3 2.8 (ref 1.8-3.8) 24 hours after latest dose. I then switched to a bottle of 60 mg pills (batch no LF03141A, exp 10/16) and my latest labs scream hyperthyroid: FT4 2.2, FT3 6.6, so both out of range. The only thing that has changed is the batch. Unfortunately, I don’t have the 125 mg bottle anymore, but both bottles were the new ones (pink/white and green/white respectively), and the pills look like the ones to the right in the photo. But, for some reason, the 60 mg pills work a lot better than the 125 mg ones…

    Reply
  142. Janie Bowthorpe

    WOULD SOMEONE PLEASE GO THROUGH ALL THESE COMMENTS AND WRITE DOWN LOT NUMBERS….and add comments about what happened to people on these batches. Also write down expiration dates and comments. WHO WILL DO THIS??

    Reply
  143. Pattycakes

    Janie, is there some way that you could post a chart with columns for the info you need, then we could each go there & fill in the info we have?

    Reply
  144. beano

    So I posted back in June about doing poorly on ERFA. I am now on Amour thyroid- and heres my update
    first- here was my initial post in June:

    bean
    June 18, 2014
    I was on the old Armour when it all changed- horrible- so went on Nature-throid, same thing happened with that company!! So is Nature-throid OK now??!!
    Then because of it all- i went on Erfa a few years back. This week I called my pharmacy to refill (recommended by this site- universal drug store)- and they said NO Erfa available- and hasn’t been for a month. I came online to research, and found these comments on Erfa. I wonder if this is why they can’t refill my Rx ?
    I “thought” i was doing OK on Erfa, until a thought back a few months to beginning of 2014 and remembered (maybe Feb ?) of horrible symptoms- extreme muscle pain and fatigue, and just thought it was the time of the year changing. I sonde if IT WAS Erfa??!! It lasted awhile and was so bad i thought i would loose my job.
    So after Universal Drug could not refill my RX, I contacted Erfa.
    heres what they said
    “it is now available” end of message by Simon Soucy (president Erfa).

    So then I wrote back asking due to what I’ve read have they changed anything with Erfa. Here is their response:
    “No ,
    Thyroid is the same product since it introduction 25 years ago.
    There is no change in the formulation. I invite you to communicate this to
    whoever said this.

    Regards

    Simon Soucy
    President
    Erfa Canada 2012 Inc. ”

    wow- very blunt and to the point.
    great- now as a patient who does not have the energy to figure this all out- I have to or bear the miserable results.

    hope this is information to anyone seeking it

    ———————-
    update 8-2014

    So- Ive come around 360 degrees. Armour back in 2009 I think, was the thing that got me switching all around since reformulating and doing bad. Then nature-throid changed, and so on until I took ERFA. So I changed back to Armour (thats what the pharmacy gave me and what my inexperienced in NT endo called in. I think Armour is doing better. I am DEFINITELY better than when taking ERFA !! I was a bit skeptical about going back on Armour since it sent me on this medical wild goose chase through hell and back- but thought i’d try it and if it didn’t work I could ask for something else. So far feel ok, Ive lost 4 pounds and shed waist fat for sure (on ERFA was STUCK in a weight gain pattern), overall thinner, more energy. I do get periods of panic attacks and skipped heart beats so I don’t like that, and its probably due to the Armour (hypo? Hyper ? ) . I’m going to stick with it and see how it treats me for now since its way better than Erfa. The price went up , oh well. And by the way- I asked for my LOT numbers on the Erfa- and they WOULD NOT give them to me! Ok bye for now.

    Reply
    • Anna

      Thanks, that sounds really reassuring! I have also been considering going back on Armour, after feeling hypo (confirmed by labs) on as much as 8 grains of Erfa…a practical question: do you swallow, crush or mix your Armour pills with honey or sugar?

      Reply
      • beano

        based on info on this site, I chew up and dissolve the Armour in mouth, rather than swallowing. There really is no taste

        Reply
    • Sandra

      Beano,
      Thanks for your letting us all know how you are doing because there are those of us who are not able to get another product and as time moves on, you do start to forget how you once were when you were well, at least I do. I truly wished I’d kept a journal of each and every day of the good days so I could compare to now.

      Reply
      • Chris

        Sandra, when you said: ” I truly wished I’d kept a journal of each and every day of the good days so I could compare to now.”; you said a mouth full. If only we had documentation with which to compare, from when it was that we felt good, including test scores. But how many of us were thinking about such documentation in our prime, or even knew about the appropriate tests. An even bigger question, did our doctors know?!

        On August 15th I began playing “Guinea Pig”, by taking Nutri-pak bovine Thyroid, starting with a similar amount (130mg) to what I had last taken of Erfa (120mg). Not knowing their relative strengths, I split the tablets in half, and divided the dose, morning & evening. After three days, I added another half. Yesterday, took a total of two tablets, and have noticed a slight budge in my basal temperatures; up from 97.2 to 97.4, 97.5, and now 97.7. Pulse rate has not changed, no nervousness, but maybe a little improved feeling of attention, yet calm. Could still use more energy though.

        Apparently, this product is FDA approved as a supplement, and is not treated as a drug, so no Rx required. Why? I do not know. So far, I give it a “thumbs up”. Time will tell if it deserves two.

        Reply
        • Anna

          Interesting, thanks for posting! I’d be interested in hearing from people having tried both Nutri-Pak bovine thyroid and Thyrogold!

          Reply
        • Angela

          Hi Chris,
          Not sure if you come back and read previous comments but unfortunately I don’t think we can get that in Canada :(.
          Once again we are stuck with no options but to pray things go back. My quality of life at 51 has changed and it sucks and no, it’s not menopausal symptoms!

          Reply
  145. Janie Bowthorpe

    TO EVERYONE: I have started a GOOGLE DOCUMENT to record BATCH/LOT NUMBERS plus your reactions. You can comment right on it here: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1SpdSQ6EKhzMHSGGTTPd3FblzCBrAjD6FZnVYPzmTMIc/edit?usp=sharing

    You either have to have a google page or gmail to comment.

    NOTE THAT I GLANCED AT A FEW OF YOUR COMMENTS AND ADDED WHAT I SAW. But this is not everyone. So add accordingly.

    Reply
    • Anne

      Janie the link takes me to a page telling me to clear my cache, but nothing about Google docs or your page. How can I find it? I will sort the batches that have been reported on another site too.

      Reply
  146. Daivid Tomen

    Hi everybody, thought I chime in. I was quite happy on the “old” erfa for a couple of years and couldn’t get it anymore. I switched to NP Thyroid made by Accela Labs in Georgia. It’s working as well for me as the old erfa (never did try the new and improved version) in the same amounts, and I take in sublingually.

    Reply
    • Dianne

      That’s good to know about NP Thyroid, Daivid. Thanks for telling us.

      Reply
  147. Janie Bowthorpe

    WOULD SOMEONE AGREE TO GO THROUGH ALL THE POSTS AND RECORD THE BATCH NUMBERS PLUS SYMPTOMS and put them in the Google Doc link I posted? There can also be symptoms posted even for those who didn’t know the batch number.

    It’s also important to avoid posting symptoms for those who may just be experiencing the results of having low cortisol and/or low iron. We’ve got to separate those two issues the best we can i.e. a bad batch vs the results of having low cortisol/low iron.

    Anyone willing to volunteer to do this?

    Reply
  148. Nick

    I got the results of my recent blood test last Friday. These were requested by the hypertension nurse rather than my endo.

    What is really interesting is that despite me feeling really hypo for the last six months, TSH, T4 and T3 results were the same as they have been over the last few years when ERFA worked well for me.

    However, it should also be noted that I had been taking 3 grains a day instead of 2, and that seemed to have made no difference to the blood test results.

    Unfortunately I’ve gone down with a nasty throat infection, so am still not in a position to evaluate how well I am now doing on the Thyroid-S (started after the blood test).

    Reply
  149. Chris

    Nick; Here’s a little something gleaned from “The Thyroid Summit”: When hypothyroidism is adequately treated, BP and cholesterol numbers decline; not because of manipulation of numbers with drugs, but because an underlying deficiency has been corrected.

    Been working on paraphrasing something else gleaned from the Thyroid Summit. It’s complicated; involves a pool table analogy; but I think that it might help explain some of the problems we have been having. Hope to have it done by tomorrow.

    BTW Nick, hope that your throat is feeling better.

    Reply
    • Nick

      Thanks Chris. When I was called in to see the hypertension nurse, I told her about the thyroid problem, and to her credit, she agreed that it was most likely pushing up my blood pressure.

      I was pleasantly surprised as most doctors today focus on one area, seemingly oblivious that all parts of the body are interconnected in some way.

      The throat is a little better today thanks.

      Reply
  150. Sandra

    Hi everyone,
    I started a new batch of pills a couple of days ago 30 mg and when I ordered them the week prior was told over the phone what batch/lot they were but when I called again today to actually write it down (which I should have before) they told me those pills were all gone and they have since reordered a new batch/lot and don’t keep records of previous ones dispensed.
    The very next day after starting them I immediately felt better, mood, energy etc and I have my fingers and toes crossed that it continues.
    These new pills also have next to know scent to them as the previous ones always did so I was very reluctant they would be better which does prove this is not a psychosematic (sp) thing.

    Reply
    • Nick

      Sandra, isn’t there a batch number and date on the bottle?

      Reply
      • Sandra

        Hi Nick,
        Sorry I didn’t see this question of yours. My presciption is filled into a different bottle that the pharmacy gives me so I never see the bottle that it comes in from Erfa.

        Reply
  151. Tammy

    I still have enough of the old Erfa to last at least 6 months since I order 500 ct bottles. I decided to go ahead & try NP Thyroid by Acella. I did not want to wait & run into the problems I did when I was taking Armour when they reformulated. My levels were all out of whack & I’m not letting that happen again. I have been taking it for a couple of weeks now & so far doing ok. I like I can do it sublingually. With my Ins. It’s now a better price at $20 for a 3 month supply. I was paying $80 for 500 tablets of Erfa which has gone up to $175. A friend told me to order the Thyroid S but it seems to have a lot of unnecessary ingredients in it. I doubt I will switch back to Erfa if they ever fix the problem as long as I’m doing ok on NP Thyroid by Acella. Thanks to this site I was able to find an alternative.

    Reply
    • Chris

      Tammy,
      Glad that NP Thyroid by Acella is working for you. So far, Nutri-Pak bovine appears to be working for me, and for now, I plan to stay with it. It too is a more thrifty product than Erfa. 500 ct bottles were never an option on Erfa’s US web page. My last invoice from 9/9/2013 lists 3 – 100 ct bottles of 60 mg @ $41. USD each, for a total of $123. PLUS around $36. for shipping and handling. A roughly similar amount of Nutri-Pak bovine figures out to be about half, mg for mg.

      Another insight from Compounding Pharmacist Rudy Dragone described the FDA standards for acceptable levels of T4 and T3 in desiccated thyroid glands. Given the standard of: 39 mcg of T4, and 9 mcg T3 per grain of desiccated thyroid; the FDA allows a deviation of up to 9 mcg, UP or DOWN of either T4 or T3. That means there can be anywhere from 18 to zero mcg of T3; and 30 to 48 mcg of T4 per grain, and STILL BE ACCEPTABLE to the FDA. Armour is said to go by that standard. But according to RLC Labs, processors of Naturethroid and Westhroid, anything above 2 mcg deviation, up or down, and they reject it. I have no idea what acceptable tolerances would be to Erfa. If what they were using came from the US, and not just “North America” as stated in that interview of Dr. Knafo, then it ought to have been assayed as to content by the FDA.

      With so many hypothyroid patients, it’s not hard to imagine that there might also be hypothyroid pigs. After all, they are close to our own DNA, and they too are subject to many of the same stresses in their short lives; GMOs; declining minerals in the soil where their food is grown; pollution; antibiotics; plus overcrowding from factory farming… I am still leaning towards a change in whatever they have been fed, at least contributing to the problem.

      Reply
      • Chris

        As promised:
        Registered Pharmacist Rudy Dragone by Dr. David Brownstein M.D., offers an interesting pool table analogy to describe the interaction of thyroid hormone on the body. I have done my best to transcribe the conversation between the doctor and pharmacist, and where necessary, to paraphrase.

        Picture a (North American) pool table. There are six pockets in the table, and for this illustration, sixteen balls (including the cue ball). Imagine the pockets as thyroid receptor sites, and the balls as thyroid hormone. Throw all sixteen balls across the table, and one or two will sink, and the body’s biological needs are met. As thyroid levels decline, it’s like taking away a couple of balls, but the body compensates by “up-regulating”. Imagine two more balls are taken away, then two more, until there are only half as many balls remaining. Meanwhile, in response to the declining levels of thyroid hormone, the body has compensated by “up-regulating” the number of receptor sites. “By the time you have eight balls on the table, the body has compensated by putting twelve pockets on the table. You have half the number of balls, but twice the number of pockets, so if you through all eight balls on the table, one or two of them will sink, and the biological function continues. The problem comes when you are down to two balls on the table, but now there are thirty pockets. This is when the person presents to the doctor, and what they see is a hypothyroid patient.

        Dragone further explains that during the shortage; deprived of Armour, patients were meanwhile “up regulating”. Their bodies were in need of more, but they were getting none.

        When Armour returned to the market; though they now needed an even larger dose than what was previously sufficient; to start with that much, it would be like throwing all sixteen balls on the table at once. But now, with 30 pockets instead of six, maybe as many as ten balls would sink, and you suddenly have a patient with palpitations, and all the problems associated with thyrotoxicosis. It takes time for the body to adjust to gradually increasing doses, by “down-regulating”, or closing off the number of receptor sites.

        I have been in touch with Rudy Dragone R.Ph. by email, hoping to encourage him to get together with the artist who produced the “chalk-talk” drawings for Bill Sardi. The concept could make a great dynamic illustration of how the body interacts with thyroid hormone.

        Reply
    • Jen

      Where do you get that one without an RX?

      Thyroid – S is terrible along with a terrible list of ingredients. I used it once after Armour back in 2009 and I was a mess.

      Reply
  152. Margaret Del Castillo

    I was treated with radioactive iodine in 1983 for Graves disease and was on Synthroid I convinced my doctor to start me on Erfa thyroid in March 2014. He decided 125mg was the dose over a period of 8 weeks I became hyperthyroid. It was horrible, I got very upset and told the doctor I won’t take anything until he orders me a thyroid uptake test I took nothing for the next 8 weeks and felt a lot better. June 18 I had the thyroid uptake test, results were 4 hour uptake within normal range of 11% normal is 4-15
    I was then put on 60 mg of Erfa. every day about 2 hours after taking the pills I became completely exhausted. I cut it down to 1 1/2 pills and still didn’t feel much better, I am very depressed, thinking again about just giving up and taking nothing but I cannot find out if I would die without anything. So, I’m back on 2 pills My last test results August 15 were TSH 3.8300 , T4 9, T3 7 MD said reading is ok
    I’m very disappointed to find out the Erfa is not working I was on Synthroid for over 20 years and had many side effects. It took me a long time to find a doctor that would prescribe it. I really don’t know what to do anymore. The doctor is an endocrinologist but it’s my opinion he knows nothing about the thyroid, and only goes by test results

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      Margaret, this is why we, as patients, learned the hard way to start on only 60/65 mg, and raise by 1/2 grain every two weeks or so, to find the right dose…not start on higher doses. But…with Erfa being a mess right now, and the company denying what patients say is going on, it’s hard to know if you will get a good batch or a bad one. But you will also need to make sure that your “hyper” wasn’t caused by having inadequate levels of iron and cortisol–both which need to be optimal. Learn this page: http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/things-we-have-learned A nd hang in there. This is only a bump in the road. Many Canadians have been switching to other NDT products.

      Reply
    • Chris

      Margaret, what you described is exactly what Pharmacist Rudy Dragone was talking about in his pool table analogy. How the body “up-regulates” and “down-regulates” the number of receptor sites; and how the differing number of sites respond to too changes made in the amount of thyroid hormone. Dragone says he gives talks to young doctors so they will better understand how thyroid hormone acts and interacts; to which they have been reported to respond: “Why don’t they teach this like that, in med school???”

      Just as you said about your doctor, he “only goes by test results”. That’s because he is doing what doctors have been taught to do. But here is a test you can monitor yourself: take your temperature, and make a chart. First thing in the morning, find your basal temp; then average a few more readings during the day. Off the top of my head, Dr. Dennis Wilson (Wilson’s Temperature Syndrome) suggests an oral basal temp below 97.8 F. (36.56 C.), indicates a slow metabolism. Above 98.6 F. (37. C.) indicates a fast, or hyper metabolism. The rest of the readings during the day should average out to be around 98.6 F. (37. C.).

      It is not completely clear what size tablet you are talking about. You say: “I was then put on 60 mg of Erfa. every day about 2 hours after taking the pills I became completely exhausted. I cut it down to 1 1/2 pills and still didn’t feel much better”. One and one half pills of what size? I How much Erfa did your doctor start you on? Did he start you out with a low dose and gradually increase it until you reached 125 mg? Hopefully he didn’t start you on the full amount all at once.

      Determining the right amount of NDT for you is going to take time. Even though you may eventually end up taking the amount your doctor suggested, you are going to have to get there gradually, as your body adjusts to changing amounts, and shuts down excess receptor sites. Until you arrive at that dose, it’s probably not going to be fun. Of course, it would help if present results of Erfa were consistent. However, it might be a tough sell to get your doctor to prescribe something different now, since this first attempt at NDT hasn’t gone smoothly.

      During all those weeks of too much; then nothing; then again apparently too much; you have been sending your body mixed messages.

      Think of driving a car… if you turn the wheel too sharply and too quickly, you can over steer, and loose control. You have to turn the wheel just the right amount, in the right direction, and at the right time, while applying just the right touch on the accelerator, to keep safely under control.

      Reply
    • Teresa

      Margeret…Don’t loose hope..My gland was burnt out as well with radioactive material, I was only 25…Did the synthroid thing for 20 years..Switched to Armour two years ago didn’t know then about the change in the Armour..However I researched a product called Pure Thyro made from New Zealand animal stock I take two a day with the reformulated Armour and another product called Zeno-x which contains Iodine from food sources. A great company established by Dr Bob Marshal…I was on 90 mg of Armour which is equivalint to 150 mg of Synthroid…Went to the Dr. for lab results I was very Hyperthyroid. She had to decrease the dose to 60mg…Went back in 6 weeks guess what same thing now Im on 30mg..What a miracle….which means that Pure Tyro along with the Iodine and Armour has done it’s Job…I live in NYC I used to drag up and down the subways ..Now its a Breeze…Praise God….

      Reply
  153. Jay

    Question: Do Tablets with “no smell” work?

    In years past, when you opened up your Armour thyroid bottle you looked for that distinctive smell to know you were getting the REAL thing. The “old” Erfa had this same smell.

    Question:

    If you have noticed that your Erfa tablets have less or no smell compared to your OLD Erfa tablets………..do your “no smell” tablets “work”?

    Reply
    • Judith

      I find funny to see that whatever we have, something is wrong…
      Let me explain. At the begining of the Erfa replacing Armour new formulation story, everyone was upset of the Erfa pills’ smell. (Not strawberry neither mint ^^)
      And now that the smell is not as bad, it has to be wrong to…
      The main difference between synthetic and natural formulation is that natural is not necessarily 100% the same batch to batch. Maybe the pigs ate something different or Erfa did something in order to reduce the bad taste of the pills I don’t know…
      I’m currently on 60mg thyroid (no batch number sorry my pharmacy took it off :s ) No strong smell compared to my previous bottle and I’m as find as I can be 😉
      Note to Erfa :I like to take my medication sub-lingually so if you want to make a flavoured pill you would be my hero ^^

      Reply
      • Dianne

        I find the flavour of old ERFA to be just fine, and I’ve been taking it sublingually for 6 years. I vote ‘no’ on adding any flavour… no offense. Not that ERFA is actually listening to us – ha. I don’t even like my supplements to have ‘fruity’ flavour.

        Reply
        • Dianne

          Many of us have problems with any unnecessary added ingredients, also. Keep it simple, is my motto.

          Reply
  154. Jen

    So, the only question I have that I haven’t seen an answer to yet…

    What the hell do we use now that ERFA has failed us the way Armour did back in 2009?

    Reply
    • Chris

      Jen, I have moved on to Nutri-Pak NZ bovine thyroid. It is treated like a supplement by the US FDA, so it doesn’t require a prescription. It may not be the total answer for you, but it might get you by for awhile in a pinch, until you get a hold of something else to try. Yesterday I stopped in at my favorite health food store; prepared to ask if they could possibly order some for me; but they already had it on their shelf! Granted, it cost more than the order I placed for the same thing from Washington State a couple weeks ago, but it totaled less than half of what a similar amount of Erfa would have been, considering the cost of CA postage to the US.
      If only it was as pleasant to take sub-lingually as Erfa. It is gritty! Take it with water.

      Reply
    • Chris

      Jen, This Sept 6th post is actually a reply to yours from Sept 3rd. Sorry I didn’t see it right away, The way this format works sometimes makes things easy to miss. Some of this I have stated before, but I made a discovery a little while ago that I want to clear up. (Redux) Nutri-Pak NZ bovine thyroid is treated as a supplement by the US – FDA, rather than a drug; thus no Rx is required. I bought my first bottle of 90 count, 130 mg tablets over the internet, before discovering that my local health food store in Redwood City, CA already had it on their shelf. A web search for: Nutri-Pak NZ bovine thyroid provides several mail order sources. When I ordered, I chose the one closest to me, for quickest delivery. But if you happen to have a health food store that deals in a variety of supplements, you might want to check them out. A “run of the mill” grocery store or even drug store, probably won’t stock this along with their vitamins and supplements.

      With mention a few days ago about ‘counterfeit’ pharmaceuticals, the following discovery has me wondering… Both bottles that I have here state that they have been manufactured and packaged by the same provider in Wautoma, WI, (www.nutrapakonline.com), however, the labeling is slightly different. One is shiny, the other not. The two bottles are slightly different in style, threaded vs. snap cap. Besides containing bovine thyroid, the first bottle states other ingredients as: Vegetable Sterate, Starch, Di Calcium Phosphate. The second bottle states: Di Calcium Phosphate, Vegetable Sterate, Pharmaceutical Glaze, Piperine. It is also interesting to note that the first one suggests one tablet per day, “or as otherwise directed”. The second states: Two tablets daily, “or as otherwise directed”.

      I have not been taking 1-1/2 – 130 mg tablets (roughly 3 gr.) long enough to compare them otherwise. Plus I plan to keep the second bottle sealed until I need it, so I won’t be able to scrutinize them further, for now; other than to ask some leading questions of Nutri-Pak, such as: can they account for the bottle and labeling differences? I have never deliberately smelled any thyroid preparations, so I can’t judge good or bad by that. If anything needs to be covered up by adding flavor, with either porcine or bovine, I’d go for BBQ. 😉

      Reply
  155. Helene

    Hi All
    I went on to the website to see about hypothyroid and menopause and discovered this post on Erfa. I have been on it fo 2 yrs and doing great. I’m from Canada. I’m not sure if I’m feeling bad because I’m almost 50 and possibly hitting some perimenopause symptoms or if it’s the Erfa causing it. What I have not come across in these posts yet (maybe I’ve missed them) is anyone showing there blood work and any changes? I’m having trouble concentrating, orgetfull, sleep is disrupted and muscle are aching more then usual and I’ve had a couple hits of depression that have come and gone out of the blue. I can’t tell if it’s menopause symptoms or Erfa(I looked at pills and I don’t get bottle so they look to be shinier and mores specs and no smell like they used to) I’m going to see doc next week to get full blood work and hormones checked. But if anyone has had significant changes to T3,T4,TSH I’d be interested to know. Thank you, Helene

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      Not everyone had big changes to their free T3 and free T4, even though they still felt awful on Erfa!!

      Reply
    • Dianne

      I agree with Janie. If, by chance, there were changes in one or more other ingredients, that wouldn’t affect labs, I don’t think. Unless that is if we want to personally rule out some other issue than FT3 and FT4. In fact, Dr. Knafo asked me to get blood work done, and I didn’t agree with that angle they were trying to take by saying something must be changed in our bloodwork. I know in my heart it’s something that is not related to the concentration of thyroid hormone, or with *my* iron (for example) levels, etc.

      Reply
  156. fliss

    i am based in the UK.. had old batch ErFA and was stable on 3.5 grains, had been doing really well on it for 4 years and very happy with it, then in july i had to start new bottle and have been feeling awful since, exhaustion aching legs… bizarrely my morning basal temp is ok at around 36.7. sometimes 36.8…why is this? I am waiting for blood tests next week…i have gone yp to 4 grains but it hasn’t helped..i am considering switching to NP thyroid… what dose should i start on? 3.5 grains? or do we need to start at the bottom again on 1/2 grain and move up slowly>?

    Reply
  157. Lola

    fliss.. You should be okay on the NP thyroid. This is the brand from Acella? right? I would take only
    2.5 or 3 grains of the NP at first since some folks say the NP is so easily absorbed compared to some of the
    others and then work back up to your 3 – 3.5 grains. You should be able to tell by your relief of symptoms
    if it is working well for you. I have switched between NP – Acella, WP and Naturethroid (RLC Labs) and had
    no problem, even using the same dose.

    Reply
    • fliss

      Thanks Lola thats helpful.. do you know why my temp is still ok but i am so so exhausted with constant aching legs since starting new ERFA?
      I am one of the lucky ones who gets NDT prescribed by my dr as many in the Uk don’t..so am waiting for NP by acella to arrive , could take a few weeks…if that brand doesn’t work for me are there any others that are done sublingually or is this the only other one apart from ERFA? how did you do on WP and nature thyroid? have you tried armour?

      Reply
      • Lola

        I was on Synthroid when I was first dx way, way back in the mid-nineties. All my blood work looked fine but… I had profound exhaustion, depression, severe body
        aches… you know the drill. I was dumb back then about NDT but researched and found out about natural thyroid. My doc was a jewel and agreed to rx the NDT.
        I took the old Armour and did fantastic on it. Then the Armour fiasco and I changed to Erfa and did wonderfully on that also. Now the problem with Erfa (the ‘new’
        Erfa makes me lightheaded and dizzy) and I have had to experiment with various NDT brands.

        I have a theory and it could be all wrong but… they say it takes a few weeks for the t4 to build up in your system whereas the t3 is felt immediately. Maybe the t4
        from the old/new Erfa is still in your system but the symptoms from low t3 are showing up ‘immediately’? In other words you have enough t4 or are getting enough
        t4 to keep your temp up but the other symptoms of hypo are making themselves felt with a vengeance? Maybe?

        I use all the NDTs sublinguially. In the past few months, I have used Naturthroid by RLC Labs, WP Thyroid by RLC Labs and NP Thyroid by Acella. I must admit, I
        loved the Acella product. It tastes more like the old Armour (sweet) and my body ‘sings’ on it. You know what I mean. The WP works well but the Naturethroid doesn’t
        seem to cut it for my body. I didn’t change my dosage with any of these. If I were changing from the ‘new’ Armour to one of these others, I would lower my dosage since
        Armour isn’t absorbed as well as these other brands.

        Just be patient. Your NP by Acella will be in shortly and hopefully, your hypo symptoms then will be a thing of the past. Be sure to keep us posted on how you do. Just remember
        to use it sublingually like your Erfa and use a little less for the first week or two… like 2 grains or 2.5 grains?…. see how you do?

        Reply
      • Lola

        fliss.. I forgot one thing. If you try WP by RLC Labs or Naturethroid by RLC Labs, the dosages are a little different. On one or one and a half grain dosages, the
        excess isn’t enough to be significant but on larger doses you might tell a difference and might have to back off a smidgen.

        Armour and Acella are… 30 mg – 1/2 Grain 60 mg – 1 Grain, etc

        Naturethroid
        and WP are ……… 32.5 mg- 1/2 Grain 65 mg – 1 Grain, etc

        So, it is always a good idea to have your rx written for dessicated thyroid in Grains instead of mgs
        if you are shopping for different brands.

        Reply
  158. Anna Östberg

    Hi
    First of all, LOVE this page. The info here saved me. Thanks!!!!!!!!!!!!! Been on ERFA Thyroid for almost 5 yrs now, getting my life back after 9 years on Levaxin. Took me almost two years to convince my doc to let me change, and about a year to get “normal” again. And I started to build up a life again. Feeling happy and safe. But earlier this year the pills suddenly looked a bit different, tasted different and had a different texture. After a few months I started getting all kinds of hypo symptoms back. Of course I started to think I’d done something wrong, you know, the old blame myself/shape up game. Finally I went here to see if I’d missed some vitamins, minerals or something. And I find this. So horrible, so scary on so any levels. And the response from ERFA! Outrage.
    I wonder if anyone knows if something good has happened? Or if they are sticking to their story that nothing is wrong?
    Best regards
    Anna

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      Anna, they appear to be denying that anything is wrong still. Sad.

      Reply
      • Anna Östberg

        Janie, thank you. Sad, scary as well as a really stupid behavior on their part, surprisingly stupid. They will loose business and have a tainted brand, things that cost a LOT of time and money to rebuild. The persons I know also on Erfa and myself have decided to stop using them. And I guess we are not alone, the word is spreading.
        Again, thanks for the fantastic STTM and all the time you’ve put into it. If ever in Sweden, drinks/dinner/coffee are on me!
        Anna

        Reply
        • Janie Bowthorpe

          I agree, Anna. I always respect a company more if they admit there’s a problem and work to fix it than I do one that completely denies a obvious problem.

          And as far as being in Sweden, if that ever happens, I’m lookin’ you up. 🙂

          Reply
  159. fliss

    i found an old bottle of ERFA and have noticed 2 things: old ones definitely smell stronger than new and old ones are harder to dissolve and need breaking up a bit…anyone noticed this? what are the other differences between the two and does anyone know why my morning temps are still ok around 36.7 but i feel so lousy?
    thanks

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      Fliss, there are others who notice that certain parameters “look” fine yet they feel lousy on Erfa now as compared to pre-2014 batches. And no one knows what’s going on, and Erfa appears to be refusing to look beyond their supposed lab evaluation of the T4 and T3 content in the tablets. I personally lose respect for companies who take this head-in-the-sand approach.

      Reply
    • Lola

      Fliss.. If you look up at the top of this page, there is a picture shown of the ‘new’ and the old Erfa. The ‘new’ Erfa is just a tad darker than the old, the new is shinier
      and the letters are more deeply embossed into the pill. Those are the main physical differences. Also if you ck your bottles (old and new), the new seem to have
      longer lot numbers. But that may not be a good way of judging since reactions/reports are mixed between old lot numbers and new lot numbers from users.

      Reply
  160. fliss

    thanks for this..yes i just compared the ones i have and they are exactly as you describe. i don’t have batch numbers as here in the uk the pharmacist dispenses them in brown bottles not in ERFA bottles. i just know i was fine until i started new bottle in july. luckily i have now found about 100 old ERFA in my cupboard so am back on them until i can change to NP or another brand or until this is resolved.
    thanks for all your help and for alerting us to this problem as i didn’t know what was wrong with me until i saw this.
    fliss

    Reply
  161. Susan

    I have questions. I am totally new to this concept and thought and such. I was diagnosed several times and by several doctors with fibromylgia and refused to accept it cause of the total body and joint aches and pains daily. I had just accepted that it was arthritis like the rest of my family had. I am anemic which I was told was caused from my bariatric surgery and years ago was put on thyroid meds just cause doctor said it might help my weight problems. My mother had a thyroid goiter back in 1964 removed that weighed 9 pds so I know it in the genes. I have had thyroid tests run over the years all to come back normal. I now suffer daily of body aches and pains and my hips, knees, shoulders, wrists, and feet hurt so badly I can hardly walk. I am very much a advacate for holistic healing and have put off going to the doctor cause I did have the hip and knee xrayed back 6 months ago only for them to tell me it was arthritis and they want to give me injections. I guess my question here is if I get these meds you all talk about and that isnt the problem will it hurt me? Just wasnt wanting to go back to another doctor to made feel stupid and for them to make lots of money off me for nothing.

    Reply
    • Sandra

      Hi Susan,
      It will well be worth the investment to buy Janie’s books and read all you can. You may very well need thyroid medication and if you do then possibly your aches and pains could disappear as mine did. I thought I was getting arthritis too but wasn’t as bad as you sound. Within a week of switching from sythetic hormone to dessicated mine joints stopped aching and pinching.
      Best of luck!

      Reply
  162. fliss

    quick question related to my other post….the old bottle of ERFA i found and am going to use has no use by date on it…it just says it was prescribed in june 2012 so its 2 years old…will it still work or does anyone know how long shelf life ERFA has? am in the UK and don’t get ERFA in ERFA bottles just brown ones from pharmacy so no way of telling if out of date…even if they are would they still work?
    thanks

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      They last for years and years! 🙂

      Reply
    • Nick

      Hi fliss, I am also in the UK, and lucky enough to have my ERFA prescribed for me. Like you I started getting all the hypo symptoms back again earlier this year. I am still trying to get an alternative off the endo who prescribes the ERFA for me.

      My EFRA comes through Lloyds pharmacy and always has a batch number and expiry date on it.

      I did get some Thyroid-S but have had a bad throat infection since it arrived so can’t offer a valid assessment of it yet.

      Reply
      • waveylines

        Hi Nick,
        Lloyd s Pharmacy are applying for licence to stock WP Thyroid -they said it would take about two months for this process -about a month has gone by so am hopeful they will be able to order it in by end of October……hopefully your endo will switch the brand for you soon…..fingers crossed

        Reply
  163. fliss

    ok thanks Janie

    Reply
  164. Chris

    All you Hashimoto sufferers… There will be a FREE ‘webinar’ called The Hashimoto’s Institute, 9/15/2014 to 9/22/2014. I expect it to be along the same lines as The Thyroid Summit I mentioned a few weeks ago. If you go to the above URL, you can view titles from the entire week’s offerings. If it is indeed the same format, the entire program will probably be offered for an introductory price right at the beginning, then the cost will escalate. I bought access after the second day of TTS. Though costing twenty dollars more by then, I still feel the investment was well worth it. It’s good to be able to hear the free programs, but it’s also nice having permanent access to them. Several TTS programs I have accessed over and over.

    At the bottom of the web page, the offerings for each day are outlined. Each day, access to those topics are available for 24 hours. In the free format, they can only be listened to once. During free access, they can be paused, but it is a little obscure process.

    Reply
    • Chris

      This is a follow up to the free “Hashimoto’s Institute” I posted about a couple days ago. Yesterday, I devoted a few hours to downloading and listening to the bonus offerings made available for signing up. So far, I’m not enthralled. Instead of the way The Thyroid Summit (TTS) was organized around interviews; these initial recordings are more like lectures, and at times, rather tedious. In one, the doctor seems to be multi-tasking. Judging by the background noises, it sounds like he might be cooking something up in the kitchen, and occasionally turns away from the microphone. Here and there, the recording is also punctuated by loud claps of thunder, a dog barking, and kids intruding in the makeshift studio.

      Although some interesting points are made, in my estimation, too much attention is paid to TSH. He also critiques some of the ideas put forth in TTS; ideas with which I resonate, that run counter to the way main stream medicine has ineffectively addressed my own experiences around hypothyroidism.

      Maybe the actual “Institute” will improve. I haven’t given up on it entirely, but I am less excited. Each day’s recordings will be made available for 48 hours, instead of TTS’s 24. And so far, no indication of a sales pitch. However, that no doubt will come.

      Reply
  165. Ellen

    So grateful for this page and to find out about NP thyroid by Acella. After not doing well on the reformulated erfa and naturethroid, am doing as well on Np thyroid by Acella as the old erfa and old armour. Thanks for ideas on what to try after erfa reformulation.

    Reply
  166. Nick

    It’s not encouraging that we haven’t seen more positive comments about the latest batches of ERFA!

    Reply
    • Anne

      Nick I’ve noticed that on the STTM Canada Facebook page most people in Eastern Canada are still doing ok on ERFA, whereas a lot of people on the STTM International Facebook page, so mainly USA, have switched to other brands. I can’t understand how it is so regionalised unless certain batches are earmarked for export.
      Are you doing ok on Thyroid-S? I’ve been taking it for 2.5 months now and can’t decide about it. I don’t feel as calm as I used to but that could be the worry about it and what to do next, also my muscles are very painful and leg muscles quite shaky, which is new to me. That too could be a co-incidence though.

      Reply
      • Nick

        Anne, I’m still recovering from a nasty throat infection and I just feel like sleeping most of the day anyway. So I still can’t make a valid assessment of the Thyroid-S.

        I do feel slightly ‘on edge’ but is that the Thyroid-S or the infection?

        Reply
        • Anne

          Sorry to hear about the throat infection Nick and hope it goes soon. Your description of being slightly ‘on edge’ is how I feel, not all the time but it’s in the background a lot of the time. I don’t know what to think about the Thyroid-S and may have to order a blood test as I’m not due one for a couple of months, or just get something else and try that. I have an NHS endo and a private doctor, and both say I never needed thyroid meds, it’s so annoying…

          Reply
          • Nick

            The throat infection is improving slowly, and I’ve now nearly finished the month’s supply of Thyroid-S. I have to say that it hasn’t improved my health so unless another factor is involved, I won’t be buying any more.

            I have an appointment with the my endo next week when I will ask him why he hasn’t come back to me in the five months since I originally informed him that there was a problem with the ERFA that he prescribes for me.

  167. J

    Hey fellows, has anyone of you managed to get refunded?
    I’m now on WP Thyroid for some months, feeling awesome, but I spent more than 100 Euro on a huge bottle of broken Erfa that gave me nothing but horrible symptoms. Would be nice to finally get that money back, at least a part of it.
    Best of health to you all, keep hanging in!

    Reply
    • Anne

      I know of one person on the Thyroid UK forum who got a partial refund from an overseas pharmacy, but the same pharmacy has so far refused to refund me. I have a bottle of 500 x 125mg ERFA, more than a year’s supply and cost about £140, I took just three of them and was ill with each – immediate stomach upset, dizziness, light-headedness, so won’t take any more. If only ERFA would admit something we could get a refund I think.
      It’s good to know WP Thyroid suits you, are you in the US? I’ve heard from two people that WP Thyroid is very sensitive to heat and so am unsure whether to have it mailed to England because of this. I can’t decide between WP and NP by Acella.

      Reply
      • J

        Hello Anne, thank you for your reply! What you experienced pretty much sounds like what was happening to me. My pharmacy also refused to refund me, since there is no official statement about a faulty charge.
        I’m living in Germany. So far I ordered WP-Thyroid twice and it worked well.

        Reply
        • Anne

          J it’s really good to know your WP was ok after being sent to Germany, I’d love to know where you got it from because I know where one person got theirs from and it was heat damaged, so I don’t want to buy from that place! Are you able to tell me where you bought it? I know it’s not good to give sources publicly so am not sure how you can let me know. I’m currently trying Thyroid-S but think it’s making me feel jittery and my muscles hurt too much, so want to try something else.

          Reply
          • JackieO

            I would love to try to get some WP-Thyroid as well… where did you get it from? You can contact me at jackie_oh1@hotmail.com.

          • J

            Why is it not good to give sources publicly? I’m starting to be a bit annoyed by all the information masking on forums. I’m all for open information exchange. The more options we know of, the less they can do with us what they want, the more progress for everyone. Why would I not share what worked for me, you asked for it, I answer.

            I ordered my WP via Metropolitan Pharmacy München (Germany), 1 grain 100ea for 38,85€. But I do not know if they ship inside the EU. Is this the source from which a package of WP was damaged? I hope not, I really don’t want to reexperience what happened with my last bottle of Erfa.
            And after all I hope that I will not have to take those damn pills forever. I’m now living superclean and I’m going to heavily detox for the next years, hopefully my glands will restart working properly at some point.

            Edit: What is that avatar doing there and why can’t I request deletion? 🙁

          • Janie Bowthorpe

            J, there’s nothing the FDA and similar organizations want to do more than shut down websites where NDT is sold without a prescription. i.e those are the “sources” people are referring to, not places where a prescription is required. Those organizations like the FDA are in the hands of the pharmaceuticals, not in your hands. We’ve already seen the FDA have a hand in shutting down many places. So…thyroid patients who depend on these sources want them kept behind the scenes, not on a public blog like this.

          • J

            Oh, I was not aware such sources exist. Thank you for explaining, and also for revoming the picture.
            Also thank you for all your work and being so engaged! It’s so important to give people the possibility to inform and help themselves when noone else would!:)

          • Anne

            J thank you for telling me where you got your ERFA from. I’m not sure if they’ll mail to me but I don’t see why they shouldn’t and the advantage would be that Customs wouldn’t examine them! Do they want a prescription or can you buy without one? I shall give them a try.
            The ones which were heat damaged had come from a pharmacy in California and the purchaser thought they’d been damaged in transit due to extreme weather temperatures there, so yours should be fine.
            The only reason I didn’t know if you would be able to tell me your source is because I know some blogs and sites don’t allow it in case anyone takes note and closes down the pharmacy. I’ve seen it happen once here in England which was very annoying.
            Thanks again!

  168. Corry

    I finally get my Dr to prescribed a NDT and this is what I get. After reading this I’m scared. I don’t want to go crazy with symptoms. Will I be fine because I never had the original erfa or that I am just off the synthetic thyroid? Suggestions please.

    Reply
    • waveylines

      Just thought I would update you all -I was so ill on Erfa thyroid after being well on it for three years that i had to go off sick. I only started to recover when I switched brands from Erfa to WP Thyroid.. I had loads of hypothyroid symptoms including a three stone weight gain. It has taken 2-3 months to feel much much better. I have lost half a stone without trying -principally because I can do normal levels of activity now rather then crashing for several days everytime I did a bit of housework! I am hoping to be able to start walking again and ti rebuild all the lost muscle and fitness.
      I switched to WP Thyroid…..

      Am so grateful to this site -because I could not understand what was going on until I read about it here. Thank you Thank you Thank you……

      An endocrinologist has checked me thoroughly out -there is nothing wrong with me bar from suffering with hypothyroidism. The comment this Endocrinologist made was that Erfa had not been successful with the patients that had been put on it -not a brand that the endocrinologist recommends. I am lucky that my Gp has allowed me to switch to WP on the NHS…..
      Still feel angry that I became so ill through effectively poor medication -it was all so unnecessary. Shame on the company for not facing up fair and square to THEIR problem -leaving patients to suffer instead!!. We can only vote with our feet….
      I hadn’t looked at this webpage for a few weeks but I note that the problems is not going away. So Dr Knafo when are you and Erfa going to get your head out of the sand?!!!

      Reply
      • Angela

        Thank you Waveylines. I have been reading your comments, following along and it is great to hear that things are improving for you which proves to me (I’ve been affected but not to the extreme you were) that it is not in my head! Although you were not even able to exercise, I still push myself (where before I would walk as fast as I could 45- 50 minutes most days and couldn’t wait to get home and walk each night) to get the dog out on her walk each day and one symptom I have is very very poor stamina. A slight grade uphill just walking causes my throat to ache like I ran a marathon. We have no other options here in Canada unless we go back to synthetic which for now, I won’t.
        Addressing the group.
        Maybe it’s time we find out how to make other options available to us here in Canada like WP thyroid. How do we do that?

        Reply
    • Anne

      Corry what country are you in? If Canada you may find your ERFA is ok because many people there still seem to get on with it. You could ask for the batch number and expiry date then check here to see if anyone has already mentioned it, then you could try it to see how you do on it. The bad batch I have is not from the new factory but the old one in Belgium and I was told nothing is wrong with it, I’d been fine on ERFA for some years but this batch gave me immediate stomach upsets and dizziness, if this happens to you just don’t take any more! Other people are taking the tablets made at the new factory and some are fine but some are gradually getting a return of their hypo symptoms.

      Reply
      • JackieO

        I am in Canada and I just got a new refill of bad Erfa…I got them about a month ago and I’ve been feeling worse every day since starting them.

        Reply
  169. fliss

    i am having more problems now on the old ERFA tablets that i found in my cupboard. i had my bloods tested and my free t4 and free t3 were right at the top, t4; 20.8 (12-22) and t3 6.4 (3.10-6.8) all my other vits and mins were fine near top of range so not lacking ferritin or anything else…am on 27.5 mg HC and although temps are lower now they are stable so cant be low cortisol…I’ve been exhausted and constant severe leg pains keeping me up at night and making me more exhausted, feeling really desperate now as i thought the old bottle would work.. i stopped NDT altogether for 2 days and the leg pains went away the started again yesterday and been up all night in pain. not sure if I’m exhausted and feeling nauseous due to lack of sleep of hypo now! my pharmacist cant seem to get hold of NP by acella which i really wanted to try as its sublingual like ERFA…any advice on whats going on with me and what other brand i could try that maybe could do sublingually? in the UK we seem to be only able to get armour, erfa or nature thyroid …so depressed as was doing so well on erfa until july…is it worth asking my pharmacist to get a different batch and trying that? has anyone found trying new batches with later exp dates are better and if so what dates? my early morning temps dropped to 36.5 now which is the lowest its been.any advice would be great. thanks

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      Fliss, is your iron around 110 and % saturation around 35%? (Or if using Canadian labs, serum iron around 25 and % Sat around .35) That’s important. Have you done your DATS while on 27.5 HC? That’s important as well.

      Reply
  170. Pete

    I just received and opened a new bottle of Erfa Thyroid (Lot: LF03833A, Exp: 05/2017). The strong smell is gone and the tablets are softer again, just like they used to be. I have to wait and see how it works but this might be good news!

    Reply
    • fliss

      pete thats a similar lot no to the ones i have been told i can now get…please post if they work for you as if so i will get my pharmacist to order them for me..

      Reply
      • Pete

        After 3 weeks I can say that I do feel better now than I did in the past five months when I was using the previous, bad batch. I only hope they will continue to manufacture it like this in the future! I sent an email to Dr Knafo and told all this. He answered with a very short message and just told me to keep him updated (in how I’m doing). Previously he had always denied there was anything wrong with Erfa Thyroid. Was he just too busy to do it this time or have they finally realized how they’ve screwed up Erfa Thyroid?

        Reply
    • Jen

      Thanks for the info Pete. Some of us are still reading this page!!

      Reply
  171. fliss

    hi janie yes my ferritin is 126 and saturation last time was 32%. been doing DATS and up till a few weeks ago was stable every day at between 36.9 to 37 then last week it dropped and became a bit unstable at between 36.85 and 36,7…tis is when i tried the old bottle of ERFA, nothing else changed..i was hoping to reduce my HC and come off it as have been on it for almost 2 years but presume i shouldn’t do so until i have the thyroid meds stable again? my Vit D was 175 which is fine too and b12 and folate were actually slightly over range.
    i was considering trying a different batch of ERFA with later exp dates..do you know of anyone doing better on later batches being produced now? batch no for 60mg ones is LF03832A exp may 2017 and 30mg ones LF03505A / LF03507A exp march 2017?

    Reply
  172. fliss

    ok thanks…is that the same as my TPO being over 1000? i am on iron tablets due to previous low iron…should i stop them? is this why my thyroid meds don’t seem to be working? what can i do about it? my TPO has been over 1000 since diagnosis 4 years ago, it never goes down… i just thought that was normal with hashimotos? does this affect adrenals too? am i on the wrong amount of Hc? sorry for all the questions

    Reply
  173. JackieO

    I wrote to Dr. Knafo and this is what our email conversation was like:
    Dear Dr. Knafo,
    I am writing to tell you what I’m sure you’ve heard from many people now. The last batch of Erfa that I had refilled is now not working for me.
    I am having very bad hypo symptoms…hair loss, weight gain, constipation, air hunger, brain fog, headaches, anxiety, etc…Can you please tell me what has changed in your batches of Erfa? I can guarantee you that nothing else had changed in my diet, my life…nothing except a new batch of Thyroid. I am getting so very sick and need to get better sooner than later!
    Thank you for your consideration,

    Dear Mrs

    I am sorry to hear you are not doing well on our medication. We did not change any ingredients or methods but we are currently investigating any case of lack of efficacy.

    Would it be possible for me to give you a call in order to understand why this is happening to you ? I also need the batch number of the medication if you have it and I also need to know if you have any recent blood test done.
    Regards,

    So it looks like they are at least looking into it to see if something has changed…I hope. I will write again once he calls me.

    Reply
  174. Dave

    Hi Pete, I was just wondering whether you get your Erfa from Lloyds pharmacy (UK)? I had a break from Erfa because it stopped working, so went back onto Levothyroxine, which I am still on, and is like a living hell. I used to use armour, until they re-formulated it in 2009, although now I read that Armour is back to the old formulation. So, basically, I’m not sure whether to ask my GP to prescribe Erfa or Armour, both of which were purchased from Lloyds.

    Reply
    • Pete

      No, I live in Finland so we have to rely on one sole importer who then distributes Erfa Thyroid to the pharmacies (as far as I know). The importer in Finland actually just recently ran out of Erfa and we didn’t have any Thyroid left in the pharmacies for a few weeks. The bottle I just got is from the latest shipment which I guess would be one of the latest batches released. I’m keeping my fingers crossed they’ve really gone back to the “old” Erfa. 🙂

      Reply
      • Marjaana

        Hi Pete, also from Finland, I’ve just opened my Erfa, same as yours LF03833A/exp 05/2017. I did a “blind-test” with my friend, the smell is not so strong on these 05/2017 pills. Also they are much softer. I just took first of them on 20.9. so we’ll wait and see and hope…

        Reply
        • Mirjam

          Hi Marjaana! As I am also from Finland, I would really like to know how are you doing with those tablets with 05/2017!!

          Reply
          • Marjaana

            So far so good… But only 9 days since I started the new batch. I’m sceptic but somehow hopeful. I’m feeling better now, not so tired anymore! This batch is totally different compared
            to my earlier batch. Not so bad smell and much softer. Just like 2013 autumn. So I truly hope Erfa works again. I have wasted 8 months now feeling bad or very bad, with some new symptoms too. So now, fingers crossed here. I will report…

        • Anne

          Marjaana how are you doing with that batch now? Hoping you’re doing ok and we can all get some and get back to ‘normal’!

          Reply
          • Marjaana

            Hi Anne, I’m feeling good. I can’t believe it yet but now I have taking this batch since 20.9. and still I’m feeling alive! I’m going to take a bloodtest on monday 3.11. so waiting for it now…
            My batch is LF03833A/exp 05/2017. Feeling positive at the moment, it’s great after shitty
            8 months!

    • Lola

      Dave.. I have heard that the Armour in the lower doses (30 mg, especially) seems to be a softer, sweeter pill, more easily absorbed than the higher dose pills. I don’t use Armour so can’t comment
      from personal experience. Maybe get your doc to write your rx for a lower dosage (means taking more pills during the day but multi-dosing throughout the day is not a bad thing) but more pills?
      For instance .. if you are supposed to take 2 grains per day (120 mg), you would take 4 – 30 mg pills per day instead of one pill.. Just get a month’s worth and see how you do on the lower dose pills?

      Reply
  175. John

    I need your help. I ordered a 500 count ERFA 30 mg from a mail order house based in England before I read about your experiences posted on this site. I was intending to use them to supplement and/or replace my Armour prescription based upon their previous reputation, for the ability to use it sub-lingually and the cost for a 500 count supply was cheaper than what I am paying for Armour. After reading about the possibility that my order may be ineffective, I forwarded a link to this website to the supplier. So far, they have failed to stand behind the effectiveness of the Erfa and will only send me a replacement thyroid medication if I return the unopened bottle. My question is, should I try the Erfa to see if it is a good batch that would jeopardize a substitution, or should I just return it? At this time it is still in transit, and do not know batch numbers or expiration dates. I will follow up and post with the batch information when I receive the order, as well.

    Reply
  176. John

    Janie, thank you so much for all that you do. I have learned so much from both your postings, blogs and your book. I know of no other patient advocate that has provided as much time, energy and information that empowers us with the ability to work toward better health instead of good lab results. I have received my package with my ERFA 500 count 1/2 grain dose of Thyroid. I have not opened it, and wonder if it would not be prudent to just return it unopened or gamble that it may be an unaffected batch. Any suggestions? It is postmarked from Northhampton England.

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      John, it makes me feel so good to read that all the work I’ve put into this has empowered folks! I wanted NO ONE to go through what I did as long as I did. Knowledge is power! And that’s especially true when the knowledge is based on solid patient experiences, not “opinion”.

      I can’t tell you what to do other than compare your batch number with what folks are saying in their comments. 🙂

      Reply
  177. John

    Hi folks, I opened the package 5OO 30 mg to check lot#s and exp date (lot LF03508A EXP 02/2017) and I found that they are the exact same as your post from Lori T:

    “Lori T
    June 12, 2014

    I just received a 500×30 bottle shipped from the UK, exp date:02/2017, lot # LF03508A and it seems to look like an old bottle. When I compared these new pills to my pharmacy ones ( came in a brown pharmacy bottle so no idea of date or lot) they looked exactly the same, not any shinier or spotted or indented. I am currently titrating up but am pretty sure my brown bottle pills are okay so hopefully the new ones are too. Strange that the exp date is 2017 but they look the same and what I have now and am not experiencing any side effects.
    Could this mean there was a bad batch dated 2016 only?

    Are all these pills made in Canada? My bottle says Montreal Quebec Canada.”

    With this information, I will give them a try. My own experience with Armour is that after my morning dose upon awakening, by late morning and close to lunch I start to feel low energy. After chewing my mid day dose, I am re-energized. When I start taking the ERFA, I should notice right away if they are not working and will follow up with a report. My only issue has been with my supplier that would only offer a refund on a “resalable” return, which means had I found out after taking them that they were from an ineffective batch, I would have been our of luck per their return policy statement. But thanks to Jamie, her blog and all of you fellow patients I am able to make an informed decision to use the supply that I have been sent. Thank you all.

    Reply
    • Anne

      John there is one person on the FTPO Canada facebook page with that batch who is doing fine on it. I’ve read others with the same batch saying it’s no good, so it’ll be interesting to know what you think.
      If it’s ok I’ll try to get some, it’s interesting that you can get it from England but here we have to get it from the US and check the batch numbers first – of course because no-one is buying it at the moment the pharmacy I use has a backlog of the known bad batches!

      Reply
      • John

        Thank you for the information, Anne. Here is my experience. I purchased the 500 count of 30 mg Erfa, partially due to cost vs Armour and for the ease of absorption via sublingual vs chewing. My experience the morning after the first day on Erfa was that my Basal Temperature dropped significantly. And for every day I was on Erfa. My usual dose taken late morning that eliminates the reduction in energy I feel at the end of my early morning dose was ineffective on Erfa. I finally could not take the lack of effectiveness, and I communicated with the supplier who says that I am only the second person out of 1000 that has made an issue about the Erfa. And they are in Northampton England. I am having continuing communication difficulties with the company now and so far they are refusing to accept the responsibility of even entertaining the possibility that the batch I was sent was bad. More details if needed, but essentially I will continue with Armour as long as they have been as effective as they have. I just need to work on more blood tests to help determine adrenal levels and iron so that I can effectively work on increasing my dose from the one grain a day I have been prescribed. This will involve increased communication and hopefully the successful education of my doctor with the help of Janie’s new book. Wish me luck. At least on 3 1/2 grain Armour a day I am keeping most of my hair, sanity and Basal temperatures above 97.6

        Reply
        • Jen

          Anything new to report, John? I ordered a bottle of ERFA with a 2017 expiration date because it seems to be 2016 only people are complaining of. I’ve gone through so many old posts on here and FB because nobody seems to want to talk about it anymore. I figure since I am familiar with ERFA and was optimized without a thyroid….. I’ll know within days if it’s a bad batch or not. Somehow I felt more comfortable ordering it again then trying a completely new brand and having to get used to how I react to a new brand of NDT.

          Reply
      • Jen

        Anne, I would think it’s too soon to tell if they’ve been going hypo for the last month before the 2017 batches became available. At this point with all the talk of the “bad batches” and people freaking out….naturally people are scared and expecting the worst..including me.

        Reply
    • Lori T

      John I am still doing fine on that batch 🙂 I hope you have the same luck.

      Reply
    • Angie

      John,, I took that same batch. I could take it for a day or two and then I would feel weak and shaky with no ability to deal with stress. Did not work for me either.
      Angie

      Reply
  178. John

    Janie slightly off topic, I just discovered that Forest Laboratories Inc was purchased by Furiex Pharmaceuticals (Actavis?) on July 2, 2014 per USSEC Form 4. I wonder how this bodes for the future of Armour Thyroid? I do not know if this posting belongs here, but just an FYI.

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      So far, all that buy-out is done is raise the price of Armour. So doesn’t look like anything foreboding will happen to Armour since they are all about $$$$,

      Reply
  179. Beth

    So happy to see this thread is still active! I actually complained to Dr. Knafo many months ago. I received my suspicious Erfa LAST YEAR in July. My bottle came from a Canadian pharmacy since Erfa told me they did not have my dosage available (beginning of the end perhaps?). After completing about 80 days of medication, I had a gut feeling something was wrong with the product. Would you believe my bottle didn’t even have a lot number? I feel like Dr. Knafo is just a puppet – doesn’t mean harm, but he did not follow through in reprimanding the pharmacy that was distributing their unlotted product.

    I am so glad to have accidentally stumbled upon this blog – now I know others are with me on this. Currently I am on a desiccated compound, but am not feeling good on it. I tried Accella and was not happy with that either. Any other suggestions would be appreciated.

    And just for the record, my thyroid issues are because of toxic mold poisoning. I wouldn’t be taking anything if I found a cure to get rid of it. Mold destroyed my life, but if my thyroid could get the right support, things would be a lot better.

    Reply
  180. Michelle G.

    How wonderful it is to stumble upon this forum! Thank you everyone who has taken the time & effort to share their experiences because frankly, people NEED you to keep doing this!

    I’ve just started taking ERFA 60mg for one month now after being on Synthroid for 20+ years! So far I’ve only experienced minimal improvement such as slightly better sleep plus my hair has stopped falling out by the handful, however no change in extremely low energy. Still waiting on my latest Labs to confirm what my body is already telling me: that I’m still very tired & not functioning near to even 50% of my normal.
    ERFA was not my first choice however in Canada it seems to be the go to NDT. I personally would prefer to try WP Thyroid because of the lack of fillers, but have not been able to find a workaround for getting it to Canada so in the meantime I’ll continue to stay on the ERFA unless or until I my experience dictates I come off.

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      Hi Michelle. Do know that one grain (60 mg) is just a starting dose, and we’re meant to raise from it every few weeks by 1/2 grain or so. We then do labs somewhere in the 2 grain area to see our progress. See http://www.stopthethyroidmadness.com/natural-thyroid-101 But at the same time, many have found Erfa to be changed this year in a negative way, so who knows if you got a batch like that or not. Raising should hopefully give a clue.

      Reply
      • Michelle G.

        Right, thank you for that info Janie! My labs should be in any day them my ND’s intention is to raise my dose an additional 30mg then retest in 6 weeks, however, after checking out that link you provided I see that I need to alter the dose more rapidly. Also, I’m going to pay closer attention to my symptoms based on the experiences others are writing about here.

        Reply
    • Ruth

      Hi Michelle, if you are noticing even a minimal improvement, it means that it’s working for you. Normaly, we have to wait 6 weeks to have the maximum of eficiency with Thyroid. Wait 1 or 2 more weeks and (as Janie said) see with your dr if you can increase the dosage a bit… Hope it will be okay for you

      Reply
      • Michelle G.

        Thanks so much Ruth! It’s been a trip, as everyone here can attest to…although, we are so lucky to have this outlet of expression & amazing info!
        I’m now bumped up to 90 mg & feeling a bit better but a long way to go I’d say. Still waiting for those Labs to come in but frankly I already know that I’m not optimal yet.

        Reply
  181. Dave

    Hi, does anyone know if the old Armour is back to the way it was, before the re-formulation in 2009? I have read various forums that it now looks and smells like the original version. After reading the comments on this site, I’m very dubious about starting up with Erfa again, either way I need to get off Levothyoxine as soon as possible.

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      Dave, not sure if the “old Armour” is back. But….Armour started working better again by late 2010, so it’s fine.

      Reply
      • Dave

        Thank you Janie. Great site by the way.

        Reply
        • Anna

          I think those conflicting reports about a possible second reformulation are very confusing…some say Armour works better now than in 2009, while others find it as ineffective as ever. In recent months, the price of Armour has doubled where I live (Belgium). I admit to being at a loss here…but my current batch of Erfa (expiring 03/16) does not work at all, so maybe it would be a good idea to give Armour a chance…?

          Reply
          • Anna

            PS. Some have successfully combined Naturethroid with Candex (cellulase) to break down the cellulose…maybe this would work with Armour as well? Naturethroid is not available where I live, my only options are Erfa and Armour.

  182. Sam

    Hello, I’m looking to switch to a NDT from synthroid/SR lyothyronine combo and being in Canada was going to aim for Erfa. Now reading this I’m a little worried.

    Does anyone know/ has anyone bought Erfa from their new batches since the complaints to see if it has gone back?

    Thanks!

    Reply
    • Sandra

      Hi Sam,
      I will be receiving a new batch by the end of this week and of course it takes a couple of days for me to know if it is good or not but will let you know.

      Reply
    • Michelle G.

      Sam I’m currently taking ERFA for the first time ever, 6 weeks now & am not experiencing any of the debilitating side-effects that others have been reporting. However, I live in Canada & perhaps that may mean different batch numbers than those shipped to USA/INT’L locations- most probably I’d say. Why that should make any difference though is another mystery.

      Reply
  183. beano

    Sooooo, Im doing BAD. I need HELP
    I posted last month about starting Amour again since i couldn’t refill my Erfa, and i posted about doing so well. now Im doing really bad, bad for last 2 weeks (maybe since 2nd refill Armour)
    you can see my original post at bottom.
    I had a pituitary tumor when i was 8 years old- so mine is pituitary related- but never been on thyroid, etc (at time not hypo, only estrogen deficient) until last decade, maybe?.
    things downhill since started thyroid maybe do not need it but I’m trapped now- if i try to cut down, i crash
    SO NOW- Im wondering if i have adrenal insufficiency
    i have all the symptoms
    why would that be after 2 refills on armor?
    My thyroid labs came back ok
    my 8am cortisol blood test was 6.3…. is that considered too low?
    I feel so horrible, so much anxiety , palps, fatigue, etc I hope i don’t loose my job or die
    should i see a naturopath, or an internist? My endocrinologist doesn’t help- they said they do not diagnose adrenal fatigue, if i go on cortisone drugs i will gain tons of weight
    help!!

    old post:
    beano
    August 25, 2014
    So I posted back in June about doing poorly on ERFA. I am now on Amour thyroid- and heres my update
    first- here was my initial post in June:

    bean
    June 18, 2014
    I was on the old Armour when it all changed- horrible- so went on Nature-throid, same thing happened with that company!! So is Nature-throid OK now??!!
    Then because of it all- i went on Erfa a few years back. This week I called my pharmacy to refill (recommended by this site- universal drug store)- and they said NO Erfa available- and hasn’t been for a month. I came online to research, and found these comments on Erfa. I wonder if this is why they can’t refill my Rx ?
    I “thought” i was doing OK on Erfa, until a thought back a few months to beginning of 2014 and remembered (maybe Feb ?) of horrible symptoms- extreme muscle pain and fatigue, and just thought it was the time of the year changing. I sonde if IT WAS Erfa??!! It lasted awhile and was so bad i thought i would loose my job.
    So after Universal Drug could not refill my RX, I contacted Erfa.
    heres what they said
    “it is now available” end of message by Simon Soucy (president Erfa).

    So then I wrote back asking due to what I’ve read have they changed anything with Erfa. Here is their response:
    “No ,
    Thyroid is the same product since it introduction 25 years ago.
    There is no change in the formulation. I invite you to communicate this to
    whoever said this.

    Regards

    Simon Soucy
    President
    Erfa Canada 2012 Inc. ”

    wow- very blunt and to the point.
    great- now as a patient who does not have the energy to figure this all out- I have to or bear the miserable results.

    hope this is information to anyone seeking it

    ———————-
    update 8-2014

    So- Ive come around 360 degrees. Armour back in 2009 I think, was the thing that got me switching all around since reformulating and doing bad. Then nature-throid changed, and so on until I took ERFA. So I changed back to Armour (thats what the pharmacy gave me and what my inexperienced in NT endo called in. I think Armour is doing better. I am DEFINITELY better than when taking ERFA !! I was a bit skeptical about going back on Armour since it sent me on this medical wild goose chase through hell and back- but thought i’d try it and if it didn’t work I could ask for something else. So far feel ok, Ive lost 4 pounds and shed waist fat for sure (on ERFA was STUCK in a weight gain pattern), overall thinner, more energy. I do get periods of panic attacks and skipped heart beats so I don’t like that, and its probably due to the Armour (hypo? Hyper ? ) . I’m going to stick with it and see how it treats me for now since its way better than Erfa. The price went up , oh well. And by the way- I asked for my LOT numbers on the Erfa- and they WOULD NOT give them to me! Ok bye for now.

    see top post. help

    Reply
    • Sandra

      oh Beano,
      I am so sorry you are doing so very terribly. Of course i am not expert but perhaps you could get some help from the moderators on the thyroidless yahoo chat group. They have been a god sent to lots of us.
      It does sound to me like adrenal issues but it is hard because hypo and adrenal sometimes have the same symptoms and of course when you are not well, it all just becomes so frustratingly confusing what your feeling.
      Perhaps Janie could offer you some advice of a next step to take with your doctor.

      Reply
      • beano

        its hard to get to the dr because they are booked out months- so scary. they flat out told me on phone they do not diagnose adrenal “fatigue”

        Reply
        • Sandra

          Hi Beano,
          So perhaps you need to find a doctor who does diagnose adrenal insufficiency. If you go on the thyroidless chat group they can give you a list of doctors to try and contact. I know it is so overwhelming when you are so fatigued but you must try to find the right person to help you.
          Janie also does consulting so maybe she can give you some direction.
          I wish you all the best and sorry for not being of any real help.

          Reply
  184. Sally

    This is my very first “social” connection. I am thankful to have found this site. I am very new on computers but very Old with thyroid/health &complications. Total thyroid &parathyroid removal due to cancers, 40 years ago. Years of radiation, etc. but through all that I taught myself nutrition, supplementation, and organic gardening ( Drs. Back then were not taught much about nutrition.). I learned I need High doses of B complex twice a day, among many other bits of knowledge to keep me going. As an aside, my children grew up running through the room waving , saying,” hi radioactive mommy.” I’ve had a lifetime of radiation due to recurrences, etc. began at age 25.
    That is a brief history to lead into my present unpleasant symptoms. I have been lethargic, exhausted & weak, very unlike myself, for 6 mos. saliva test ( results yesterday) cortisol ok except mid day ( I feel weak & worndown from wake up to bedtime). Estrogens, 3 , too high, TESToSterone out the roof. Iron was low a year ago supplemented now, blood says is ok. I’ve suffered severe depressions thru the years also and not so great right now. Besides the high need for calcium, D, magnesium, also need huge amts of potassium x thirty + years. On synthroid .1 two x a day. A wise Dr. Added cytomel .25mcg about 25 years ago. So what is happening to me now? I am sad, frustrated, & want to be the Real Me again. Thank you for having a place I can write where someone might understand.

    Reply
    • Sandra

      Sally you simply must read all of Janies website, get her books and you will find hope in that the information she has blessed us with. Also there are good dessicated thyroid products that are superior to synthroid. Right now many of us are frustrated with Erfa’s Thyroid but there are others to try.
      Good luck!

      Reply
  185. Tammy

    Where do I find the Lot # and expiration? I’ve been using Thyroid from Canada’s Universal Pharmacy for years and with my new 6 months supply, just discovered the visual difference in the pills, EXACTLY as what’s pictured on here as the old ERFA & new ERFA. Haven’t started them yet, but I went thru the whole Armour nightmare a few years back and now my heart is sinking once again :-/ Looking for the Lot & expiration but only finding is the DIN number.

    Another strange difference that’s now raised HUGE red flags. The label on my old bottle says: “Universal Drugstore” with the address & etc.. BUT the new bottle now says: “Altec Drug Services” and with the same address & etc, and no reference at all of “Universal”.

    And here’s what a quick google search brought up regarding Altec:

    http://www.modernhealthcare.com/article/20120810/NEWS/308109962

    From 2012:
    “Altec Medical Pleads Guilty in Gray-Market Drugs Case

    By Joe Carlson
    Posted: August 10, 2012

    Altec Medical, Easley, S.C., will pay a fine of $2 million and forfeit another $1 million after the corporation pleaded guilty to buying pharmaceuticals from a gray-market supplier and then reintroducing them into the U.S. drug market for sale at retail pharmacies.

    The corporation also was sentenced to a year of probation by U.S. District Judge Robert Scola in Miami after pleading guilty to conspiring to defraud the U.S. Food and Drug Administration, the U.S. Justice Department said in a news release.

    Prosecutors charged that Altec paid co-conspirator William Rodriguez about $55 million between 2007 and 2009 for prescription drugs that company officials knew had been illegally diverted from distribution channels regulated by the FDA. The company then created fake “drug pedigrees” that purported to show that the unidentified drugs had been acquired legally.

    Rodriguez pleaded guilty to conspiracy and money laundering in June 2012 but has not yet been sentenced, according to the release.

    A spokesperson for Altec could not be reached for comment late Friday.

    According to the Justice Department, in many cases diverted drugs come from boxes stolen from warehouses or cargo trucks, from repackaged free samples or from patients who resell them for profit.”

    Reply
  186. Christie

    I just stumbled across this site and am so thankful I did. I’m blown away at what I’m readying. I have been taking Erfa’s Thyroid since I moved to Canada in July of 2012 and just figured out I needed to increase my dosage back in January of this year. I finally began to feel normal again. I picked up a refill in August, and ever since then I have been feeling terrible. I told my husband my pills look different but never thought anything about it…..until now. I have been feeling like crap! Fatigue, muscle aches, brain fog,dizziness, you name it……all because of a bad batch!? I’m angry. I feel helpless. Sorry for the rant. My question is what other options do I have here in Canada for desiccated thyroid? TIA

    Reply
    • Michelle G.

      Christie I’m so sorry you are going through all that, it sounds unbearable;-) I too live in Canada & have only recently started ERFA, 6 weeks ago, but am actually doing better on it than Synthroid (20+ years). I’ve tried, unsuccessfully to get WP-Thyroid (Westthroid)-they simply cannot ship to Canada (HPB, Health Protection Branch, Issues). One option is to get a script from a USA doctor (ND, MD etc) & get your Rx filled in the USA as well. I’m still looking into it as WP Thyroid is a superior product (Gluten-Free acceptable fillers) , IMO, though I’ve read that some people do not do well on it either.

      Reply
      • Janie Bowthorpe

        If anyone says they aren’t doing well on WP Thyroid, that’s more due to having a cortisol or iron problem, or not raising high enough.

        Reply
        • Pattycakes

          Janie i have noticed that WP Thyroid pills become gummy when exposed to air/humidity & become difficult to dissolve sublingually. Do you suppose this affects their potency?
          To avoid spoiling the entire contents of the bottle, I dispense several days into tiny zip bags, instead of weekly dispensers, whose snap lids are not as airtight as they appear to be.

          Reply
        • Angie

          Janie:
          I do not absorb it very well at all. Can’t be iron or cortisol (at least for me 🙂 ) as I’d do ok when I’d switch back. The only thing that helped with my absorption was taking a little Lact-Aid with the tablets. I am lactose intolerant so figured I may not be able to “break down” the tablets sufficiently.
          Angie

          Reply
  187. Lola

    I also have noticed how the WP changes when exposed to air. The pills in the original WP bottle w/cottom stay nice and white and separated. The ones I put in my weekly dispenser get
    a little darker, a little gummy and stick together. They seem to dissolve sublingually just fine tho w/o having to chew them a little. I only have a week’s worth out at a time so not too
    worried about losing potency during just a week. Just finished up a 30 mg/100 count bottle and started on another with no hypo symptoms so far.

    The ingredients, as listed on the package insert, are inulin, medium chain triglycerides and *lactose monohydrate (*trace amts only). I really wonder if the pills may have a waxy
    coating or some kind of oil coating to hold them together? There is nothing in the ingredients list to indicate how they manage that. I would think they would have to list anything
    like that on the ingredients list?

    Reply
    • Sarah

      Keep hold of the little drying packets that come inside the WP Thyroid plastic tubs. Transfer them into your dispensing bottles. That’s what I do to stop them from going brown and sticky…….it works.
      Hope that helps?

      Reply
  188. Angie

    Thought I’d check in and apologize (I was actually going to get lots, etc. together). We are in the middle of a move AND had a car accident that injured my back. I have now bought two lots of ERFA trying again. Not sure what is going on, but my system can not handle. This latest batch (lot #L3505A) seems to be STRONG. Too strong. Causing me anxiety and tension, sweaty palms, etc., etc. What the heck is going on with this company? Janie, is there any news or do you have a suggestion? Am really done with ERFA at this point until and unless they go back to their old plant and formulation. And don’t bother telling me that the formulation has not changed and that it’s me, ERFA.

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      Oh no Angie. Sorry to read about your back. No, nothing is being admitted by Erfa.

      Reply
    • Nick

      As far as I know, batch L3505A is one of the older batches. Does yours have an expiry date on it, and if so what is it?

      Reply
      • Angie

        Nick, this is a 2014 manufactured batch with 2/17 expiration date..

        Reply
        • Nick

          Thanks Angie,

          I had, mistakenly it seems, assumed that the batch numbers were sequential, ie each new batch had a higher batch number. But that appears not to be the case so I assume that the batch number perhaps applies to where it was produced, and we need to go by the expiry date.

          I made a discovery only the other day that my (current) container of ERFA contains stickers with two batch numbers on it. One says LF037A Expiry 02/17, and the second label says LF0305A, expiry 02/17. I’m nearly through that container now so assume that it is highly unlikely that I have not taken tablets from both both batches, and I still don’t feel better.

          I’ve just ordered some more from the hospital, and will phone the pharmacy later and see if they can tell me which batch numbers they are currently working. I did find out recently that there are another 15 (NHS) patients on ERFA from the same endo, but none of them have apparently made a complaint about it.

          I wrote to Lloyds pharmacy who supply my ERFA and asked if it was true that they had applied for a license to supply West Throid. In a typically evasive reply (does anybody do straight answers these days?) they just said that I could give them a prescription for the product that I wanted, and they would tell me if they could supply it. Hardly helpful when I need to tell the endo what I want, and therefore know in advance if it is available.

          Reply
          • Anne

            Nick is your latest batch of ERFA ok and if so can you let me know the batch number etc? When I first mentioned this problem to a private doctor who prescribes ERFA he said no-one else had complained, I don’t understand why this is only affecting some of us. I’m still taking Thyroid-S but don’t like it much and am just hoping I can find some good ERFA. I don’t want to keep switching to other brands in the hope one of them will be ok.

  189. Thea

    For what it’s worth: I was just at my (Canadian) pharmacist’s today and was informed that Health Canada had recalled the “bad batches” of Erfa Thyroid. This came about as I was checking to make sure they ordered in a 2015 or later expiry date next time they needed a new bottle for me – it’s a tiny pharmacy and I’m their only Erfa customer. I haven’t been affected because the old supply they had was all right, but I knew they were due to order more soon.

    I checked the HC site and could find no mention of such a recall. I searched in all the ways I could think of. If anyone else can find it, I’d appreciate the link to it. Maybe there are recalls that the public doesn’t get to see..?

    Reply
    • Anne

      Thea I emailed Dr Knafo and asked about a recall, because I had read about one on a Facebook page too, but he replied that there has been no recall at all. This is a shame because without one I cannot get a refund for my jar of 490+ 2 grain tablets which I can’t use.

      Reply
    • Ruth

      Hello Thea! May I ask you which pharmacy is it? I asked in different pharmacies but they were surprised of my words. They said that recalls were always official and Health Canada cannot just hide the information… Moreover they don’t care if a company has a bad image, they’re doing the job that’s all. Well it’s my opinion… Maybe your pharmacy mixed with a back order or something

      Reply
      • Thea

        Hi Ruth,

        Thanks for your reply and Anne’s too. I am reluctant to give the name of my pharmacy because it identifies too closely my own location to all and sundry, hence there are privacy concerns.
        Next week I will ask that pharmacist to give me a link, print out the notice, or email it to me. I hope this works.

        Reply
  190. Angie

    OK folks, I think that it is about time to get our complaints together and talk to HealthCanada. As I said, we’re in the middle of a move, but once that is complete, it’s time. IMHO, ERFA’s move to a new manufacturing facility was a mistake. In their initial response to Janie, they state that they haven’t changed their formulation, but my question regarding raw product source went unanswered. I can not begin to tell you all how this has affected my life. ERFA, in its old formulation, was the dessicated thyroid hormone that gave me my life back. Why it worked so well for me, I don’t really know, but it did. I have asked to see the results of their investigation and have been told that I could see IF I would sign some sort of non-disclosure (if nothing is wrong, why would I NEED to sign a non-disclosure). We need to pull in the other thyroid sites on this and approach them en masse. I am willing to help with a lot of the work, but we can not just accept this. If nothing else, then I may employ a testing laboratory to compare batches and share my own results. ERFA’s response, quite frankly, surprises me. They seemed to be very reputable and responsive to their pts in the past. Saying there is not an issue when so many people are having problems coupled with the fact that the “Investigation” results are being held very close to the vest indicates to me that there IS most definitely a problem.
    Angie

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      You’ll need to be very careful how you present this. i.e. it will have to be clear that anyone who is now doing bad on Erfa was, in fact, doing fabulous before i.e no other symptoms whatsoever and for a long while. Honesty with oneself is crucial here for the integrity of what is presented. There have been some on here who clearly have low cortisol and/or low iron, and that can make Erfa look like it’s the problem, when in reality, the problem was the iron/cortisol.

      Another good argument is presenting honestly how much better one is doing on another brand of the same amount.

      Reply
      • Sandra

        Hi Janie,
        I am in Canada and my situation is that my hypothyroid symptoms over the last 6 months were getting worse, bit by bit over time, with the exception of feeling better on only one batch (I get only a months worth of pills at a time) of pills. I have been on Erfa’s thyroid for 5 years now and been balanced on hydrocortisone as well for years.I won’t get into the details but for me, well, lets say that even though I was not functioning like before, I would forget just how great I was doing, basically back to the accepting a new normal. Well, let me tell you, this past week at work has been highly stressful and I put in longer days than usual which would have landed me on my butt (but not before January it wouldn’t have) this weekend. And today, my first day off, I was up at 6am, cleaning the house, whipped up some paleo pancakes before driving for an hour and a half for a fun day (which I have had next to none of since this Erfa disaster happened, even with taking 3, 1 week vacations this summer) to view a lottery show home, went for dinner, walked around Home Sense, drove back home, walked the dog for 30 minute and am not wiped.
        So, why did I have a great day and actually a great week? Mmmmm, could it be the Thyroid-S I’ve started at the beginning of the week? I now have 3 full bottles (3 months supply) of Erfa’s thyroid sitting in my cupboard of which I am fearful to try again and have spent my hard earned money on!!! Thyroid-S is far more expensive but so is not being able to do my job well.
        As well, I find this very very interesting. I thought I had entered into menopause as my last menses was Oct 2 last year. Well is it also a coincidence that after being on Thyroid-S for a few days that for the first time in a year it returned?
        I truly wonder.

        Reply
        • Darcy M

          Sandra,

          How are you getting Thyroid-S? I have looked into it, but can’t seem to find a way to get it. I have also looked at another Thai brand called Thiroid, but again, no way of reaching the company that makes it.
          RIght now I take a compounded NDT. Tried to switch back to my last batch of ERFA, and same as last may, they seem to not work. I thought I would try again. Thinking it might have been something else.

          I am heading to Thailand in Jan for three months and would love to know I can get something there that works.

          Darcy

          Reply
          • Sandra

            Hi Darcy,
            so sorry I have not been here for sometime. my apologies, my life has been extremely busy and stressful. There is a facebook page for THyroid-S and that should help you.

        • Anne

          Sandra, when you switched to Thyroid-S did you take the same dose as before or did you increase or decrease it at all? I’ve switched on the same dose and am not sure, feel slightly jittery, not quite a stable as I was on ERFA. Not sure if it’s the Thyroid-S or something else.

          Reply
          • Sandra

            Hi Anne,
            Yes I too found the same sort of symptoms as I took the same dose but I have been dealing with extreme stress at work and as I’m also on hydrocortisone was not sure if all I was experiencing was at all related to not enough HC or the dose of Thyroid-S. So then I was feeling quite warm and decided to lower by 30 mg and ended up quite chilly at night so put it back up by 15 mg. I will stick with that and see how I do. Big thing I’ve been experiencing is serious heart pounding at night, probably adrenal related though.

        • Cynthia

          How did you get them into Canada? I have the source, but when I select shipping to Canada its a no go! You can email me privately at cynthia.ryan @ gmail . com

          Reply
          • Sandra

            Hi Cynthia,
            That’s weird. I will check into it and email.

      • Jen

        I agree. I’m one of the ones who was on ERFA for years perfectly with no symptoms and I do not have a thyroid. I ran out of a good supply and saw this mess everyone was in and have been afraid to waste money on a reformulation or bad batch. A lot of these posts on here are not helpful to those of us NOT new to NT. Some people are simply describing their body’s reaction to just getting on NT. Or, maybe just maybe they only need a minimum dosage of NT anyway because they still have a real thyroid that works.

        NT is sort of like a stimulant. If you were going hypo like I currently am, and start getting it back into your system.. you will have some symptoms as your body gets kicked back into gear. Sorry, but I went through this back in 09 when Armour went to crap and it’s not going to be as easy as popping a pain killer for a headache and getting instant relief. It wasn’t torture but there were side effects from everything working again.

        Reply
        • Anne

          I also went through the rubbish with Armour, several of us here did. I don’t think most of us here have simply listed our symptoms and implied we were new users of ERFA, I’ve been taking it since the Armour disaster and got on very well with it, which is all the more annoying now. I have mentioned my symptoms because they were immediate on starting my latest batch, not a gradual decline as I got further into the jar, which has led me to believe there was something in them which either shouldn’t have been there or which had been degraded in storage or transit. In such a case the re-analysis arranged by the ERFA company would not have shown anything wrong because it was looking for hormone content. It is as annoying for most of us here as it it for you. I have switched to another make which I don’t think is as good and am hoping that whatever was wrong is found and admitted to so that I can go back to ERFA with confidence, for the moment I’ve lost confidence in it.

          Reply
  191. Lola

    I will throw my hat (name) in the ring as one who has done fantastic on natural desiccated thyroid for almost twenty years. I went on the old Armour back in the mid-nineties and switched
    to Erfa in 2009 after the reformulation of Armour without skipping a beat. No problems whatsoever. When my old Erfa ran out and I reordered a batch which was due to expire in 10/16,
    I became light-headed, dizzy and felt like I was going to pass out after just a few days. Since then, I have been ‘shopping around’ for a substitute and settled on WP Thyroid and I am
    doing just fine on it.. same dosage, no dizziness, no light-headiness etc. All this happened back in the spring of this year. Oh, I have never had iron or adrenal problems.

    By the by… has anyone noticed that most of the problem Erfa seems to have a 10/16 epiry date? I read somewhere that a person is doing just fine on a batch.. lot # LF03508A, expiry 2/17.
    Maybe, maybe (fingers crossed), the powers that be did have a problem with the first batches coming out of the mfg in Spain but has now fixed the problem? If so, what a shame that they
    don’t share this with us. I would switch back to Erfa in a NY minute.

    Reply
    • Jen

      No, that is what I’m trying to figure out. I’m seeing expiration dates for May 2016 and November 2016 on some sites. What is the problem batch..anyone even know for sure?

      Reply
  192. Dianne

    Reporting on a new batch that I tried a few days ago. I took one 60 mg tablet (sublingually) from a refill that I was able to find in my search for (hopefully) older stock. I can report that Lot #12K16 exp. 11/15 is a no-go. My reactions weren’t quite as bad as the reactions I had to two previous (different batches), which lasted (the reactions) for several days. The reactions I had to this batch, though, were dizziness, off-balance-‘ness’, spaciness, confusion, headache, sheer exhaustion, I got really hot/flushed, then I got really cold/shivering, stomach burning/belching. I felt so wiped out about 1 hour after taking the tablet, that I basically passed out on my bed for a couple of hours. These reactions gradually wore off as the day went on. I had saved about a week’s worth of reliable older stock that I’ve been taking for a few months now (exp is earlier 2015, and I don’t have the lot #), so I went back on those the next day, and I was ‘back to normal’.

    I have since been able to find some different 60 mg 2015 tablets. These are lot #12D261 exp. 04/2015. I pray these are older stock as I’ve only got 3 tablets left of my reliable stock. I also picked up 2 – 60 mg tablets of 2017 stock Lot# LF03831B expiry 05/2017, just to try these. It’s pretty bad, but I’m SCARED to try either one, and I have to set aside a day when I can afford to be sicker/(or, I feel almost poisoned?). If anyone has info on either of these, I’d appreciate it.

    Reply
    • Jen

      But you’ve only taken a few pills? It’s really not even enough time to know though if you only have taken a couple pills. If you were getting hypo like the rest of us, it’s not like popping an Advil for a headache and expecting instant good feeling. It needs to build up a little, and bring all your levels back down. All you are really describing is your adrenals crashing (passing out on your bed) which will happen to anyone getting NT back into their system after being hypo or going from nothing/synthetic back to NT.

      I am seeing ERFA being sold with a much further expiration date of 11/2016 which I do not want to waste money on in if nobody has tried it for at least 1-2 weeks.

      Reply
      • Dianne

        No, you’re wrong. You don’t know my history with ndt, nor does it seem you have read all of the previous posts. I’ve been on ERFA Thyroid for over 6 years now, and did pretty well on it. Then the bad ERFA batches started appearing in late 2012, early 2013. In Jan 13 I had a bad reaction to one bad tablet in one of the bad batches; and yes, instantly, after one tablet. If you look through the posts, there are some of us that have reacted almost instantly. This reaction is more of an allergic reaction to one, or more of the ingredients. Plus, it did seem to cause instant hypo-feelings in me, as well. I don’t know what the heck is in this newly manufactured ERFA Thyroid that is causing these reactions – but whatever it is, it isn’t good.

        I went back to my old stock each time after having 3 separate reactions to 3 separate lot#’s, and did fine. So this time, I tried another batch again, and reacted instantly after just one tablet, so thought I would report the lot# and expiry date. I won’t be taking any more tablets from any of the batches that give me this bad reaction; so, yes, my post was about my reaction after ‘popping’ one tablet. If it did, in fact, cause my adrenals to crash, as well; then, this is also a problem that ERFA should be addressing/acknowledging.

        Reply
  193. Jen

    Where are the updates on this story? Now people on the FB groups are saying it was a bad batch and they received a newer batch of ERFA and feel good. But since I do not have a thyroid, I do not want to take the chance. I come to this page looking for confirmation and you haven’t updated since May.

    Reply
    • Dianne

      If you read through the posts, you will see that ERFA continues to deny there is any wrong with ERFA Thyroid. So it doesn’t look like there are any updates per se. One poster says she emailed Dr. Knafo just recently, in the last week or so; and he still says there is nothing changed/wrong.

      Reply
      • Jen

        I have actually read the posts including on the FB groups and there are some people who swear they are doing fine again on the newer batches but it seems most people are reluctant to try them. I find that strange. I guess I was looking for more confirmation from real people that the 2017+ batches were good again but apparently nobody wants to touch that yet.

        Dr. Knafo seems like a puppet. All I’m getting out of the ERFA posts is that they keep changing processing companies. But thanks, I decided to go ahead and purchase something else for backup now.

        Reply
    • Anne

      It was more than one bad batch Jen. Mine were bought in November 2013, in a new style jar but made at the old factory in Belgium apparently. People are still being dispensed ‘bad’ batches of the tablets here in England even now. Those are from the new factory in Spain. I have had a long email conversation with Dr Knafo, approaching 30 emails, in which he is variously concerned, having an independent analysis carried out on all the batches complained about out, saying nothing is wrong, asking if I’ve had new blood tests done and even one asking how I am doing now. This episode has convinced my endo that ERFA was never any good anyway and he’s even more enthusiastic about Armour which I don’t get on with. I agree with Dianne that the problem doesn’t seem to be hormone content but some other ingredient or damage to an ingredient possibly during transit. Unfortunately there will probably be fewer and fewer updates because many of us with ‘bad’ batches of ERFA are all having to change to other brands. The ERFA company aren’t admitting there is any problem and are waiting for all the fuss to die down. I can only suggest that you ask what batches your chosen pharmacy can supply you with and then do a search for them here and on some of the Facebook pages dedicated to thyroid issues to see if they are mentioned as being good or bad.

      Reply
  194. Hope

    Jen do you know which batch to avoid??? I am not sure if I dare to buy Erfa again and if I dont, I am not sure which brand I should try. I am afraid to end up with all the symptoms again…

    Reply
    • Lola

      Hope.. The bad batch of erfa that caused my dizziness, light-headedness is batch # LF03139A – exp 10/2016.. 100# – 60 mg. I have a terrible habit of leaving a few tabs
      in my bottles of erfa so I have a few bottles around the house that I know were okay. The good batches (most of them probably not available anymore) are…
      I2616 -exp 7-2015, 100# 30 mg, I3011, exp 3-2016 – 500# – 30 mg., I2026 – exp 4/2015, 100# – 60 mg. I think these are all from the Belgium mfg facility. My dosage
      is 60 mg one day and 90 mg the next, alternating. So I often purchase the 60 mg and 30 mg bottles.

      When Armour prices started going up in the spring, I decided to stock up on erfa and boy.. .did I stock up. I have several unopened bottles of erfa that I am scared to
      use until we have a more comprehensive list (wish it was posted in one place) of ‘bad’ batches. The ones I have on hand that I am fearful of using are..
      LF03140B – exp 10/2016 -500# 60 mg, LF03057A – exp 10/2016 – 100# 30 mg. It would be nice if there was a formal recall so we could get refunds on
      unopened bottles.

      Hope, you should do just fine on either the WP Thyroid by RLC Labs or the NP Thyroid by Acella Labs. I am taking the WP now and doing fine. My
      hubby was recently dx hypo and his doc gave him a rx for the NP this last time and I tried it for a week or so and loved it (had hubby on the good erfa
      when he was first dx). He transitioned from the old erfa to NP with no problems. When I have my yearly thyroid ckup, I plan on asking for an rx for the
      NP since it seems to be so much like the old Armour. The 30 mg is a tiny, tiny pill tho and difficult to split. Hubby is on 45 mg per day.

      Reply
      • Anne

        Lola I was told by a friend that her batch of 1 grain LF03140B 10/16 is fine but I haven’t tried it so don’t know for sure. Thank you for mentioning how good WP and NP are, I am going to try those I think because I’m not happy with the Thyroid-S which I switched to.

        Reply
        • Lola

          Hi, Anne. Well, that tears it (friend doing fine on LF03140B) if that is true and I have no reason to doubt your friend’s experience. That means that the problem may lie with one of the fillers in the ‘new’ Erfa, a filler that people react very differently to. It seems some of us are reacting instantly to something in the ‘new’ Erfa tabs. That begins to make sense, doesn’t it? The labs would only be checking for the active ingredients and their potency. They wouldn’t be lying if they said it checked out but I wonder if they are being straight with us about different additives.

          The same thing is going on with the ‘new’ Armour… that is.. some folks doing fine on it and others doing horribly on it and everyone acknowledges that it is the filler in Armour that is the problem… it impedes absorption. If those of us who are not doing well on the ‘new’ Erfa are having an allergic reaction, that will be hard to quantify and address with the powers that be.

          The thyroid S has tons of additives and food colorings in it, thiroyd not so much. I think you will be thrilled with NP Thyroid by Acella. It is soooo like the old Armour that so many of us did well on for
          so many years.

          Reply
          • Janie Bowthorpe

            The new Armour mostly caused problems in 2009 and early 2010. Today, folks seem to report doing fine on it overall.

          • Anna

            Does this mean that Armour reformulated again; not back to the original formula, but decreased cellulose somewhat?

            Has anyone noticed a difference between various strentghs; I spent a few months on Armour back in 2012 (15, 30, 60, 90 and 120 mg pills), and did very well on it as long as I chewed the pills up. I raised it to 5 grains daily and felt fine. Then I switched to 300 mg pills, and crashed within a couple of days. So I wonder if the larger pills contain more cellulose, making them less effective? On the 5 grain pills, I took one and a half pill a day (7,5 grains), and I might just as well have taken sugar pills…

    • Jen

      I don’t know Hope. All I’m getting from many posts is that it seems like the 2016 batches. Only a few people seemed to have chanced trying anything after 2017 and it’s not enough to go by… I was on the same dosage for a few years, optimized and my last bottle expired in 2015.

      I don’t know what to do. I chickened out and ordered a 2017 batch of ERFA along with Naturethroid because I’m desperate and the website I order from has limited options. I’ve read through enough posts on here and FB that basically confirm Naturethyroid is the next most popular option especially for those of us without thyroids. I’ll either try both or send one back and demand a refund. I last used Armour back in 09 and will never trust them again.

      Reply
      • Anne

        But didn’t Naturethroid also reformulate just like Armour in about 2011? I took it after Armour in 2009 and was happy with it but then heard it was re-formulating and didn’t want to go through the same thing again so that’s when I switched to ERFA. I wonder if the people doing well on it are new users or were already taking it before 2011. I’m considering WP or NP, but would be far happier if I could find some good ERFA.

        Reply
        • Janie Bowthorpe

          The Naturethroid reformulation wasn’t like the Armour reformulation, no. It was a change, but nothing as drastic.

          Reply
        • Jen

          Yeah, I was concerned about that too Anne. I know I did try Naturethyroid back in 2009 after the Armour change but probably didn’t give it enough of a chance back then… the fact that it didn’t dissolve under the tongue well was enough of a turn off for me…. it’s what I liked abut ERFA so much. I guess we have to accept there won’t be a perfect medication that never changes… we’re all going to have to go through this every few years for whatever reason..whether it’s a reformulation or change in processing plants or something stupid. It sucks..but that is with any medication or drug..they pretty much own us in that way.

          I’m in the USA and the only thing that sucks for me about ERFA was always having a hell of a time getting an rx for it..even half an rx for half the dosage I was taking. At least if I give Naturethyroid another try, I can eventually get a doctor to write a prescription for my full dosage or partial dosage and I can get it in a local pharmacy which my insurance will cover. WP or Acella look better to me but there are no guarantees they’ll never change either.

          Reply
  195. Hope

    Hi
    I need a good advice…I live in denmark and use Erfa Thyroid but I am perhaps able to switch to NP Thyroid, Westhroid, Wrsthorid Pure og Nature Pure. Which one would you recommend?

    Reply
    • Janie Bowthorpe

      Hi Hope. They all work. It’s more about individual preferences. If I, Janie, ever have to switch, I lean towards NP Thyroid.

      Reply
      • Hope

        Thank you so much Janie

        Reply
      • Jen

        Why is that Janie? To me, it seems like WP would be the next best option due to less fillers but I have noticed Naturethyroid seems to be more people on all the groups.

        Reply
        • Janie Bowthorpe

          RLC Labs does strong marketing with doctors which is probably why u see a lot of folks on Naturethroid. But WP Thyroid is a good product, too. I just personally like the Acella company a lot.

          Reply
    • Anna

      Hope,

      If you ever switch to another brand in Denmark, I’d appreciate if you let me know…as I guess a brand available in one EU country could be imported to other Member States?

      I am desperate to find some alternatives, as I can only get Erfa in Belgium, and I hate being stuck with one brand…I have already had to raise it to 10 grains daily. This means one 100 ct bottle will last less than a month…I don’t know about other countries, but in Belgium, NDT is very expensive…which makes me even more reluctant to pay for something that does not work optimally. The few doctors who prescribe it also charge several hundred € a visit, so it’s very frustrating…a vicious circle, to be honest.

      Janie, can I interpret your comment to mean that Nature-Throid works better than Armour for most patients?

      Reply
      • Janie Bowthorpe

        Anna, no, I’m not saying that about Naturethroid vs Armour. There are patients on both and from what we can tell about reports from the last few years, they have both working well for patients. In fact, other than Erfa, that’s true with all desiccated Thyroid products. Sure there might be some odd reports here and there, which may have something to do with a patients low iron or cortisol issue that the NDT is revealing, or due to a patient reacting to a filler, or that odd bad batch here or there. There might even be the latter going on right now with some batches of Armour. But overall from reports. they all work (other than this year’s batch of Erfa in places).

        Reply
  196. Anna

    On 8 grains of “new” Erfa (4×125 mg), my FT4 levels were barely mid-range, and my FT3 levels suboptimal. I have had to raise it to 10 grains daily.

    Is there any risk of shortages of other brands, like WP Thyroid or NP Thyroid?

    I have also been considering Thyro Gold, as it has been getting great reviews, but some claim porcine thyriod is closer to human chemistry than bovine thyroid…so I’d love to hear from anyone having tried Thyro Gold!

    Reply
    • Jen

      What is the expiration date on your bottle though? But yeah, this is what I was worried about with attempting to try ERFA again… needing MORE.

      ThyroGold was also recommended to me by people having success with it. If I were to actually try it, I might just get blood work tested more often just for curiosity or peace of mind.

      I don’t think pig vs ox or cow or whatever thyroid matter at this point in time. The more sources the better because it seems we’re all getting desperate as the years go by. If one animal is half the human chemistry, seems we would just need more of the other kind to make the same amount. Ugh, remember the Armour shortage? That was scary especially for those without thyroids.

      Reply
    • Lola

      Anna, Jen… Check out nutripakonline.com also. Seems to be like Thyrogold at half the price. It was mentioned by another poster on this site (ck earlier posts) and it is offered in bovine or porcine.

      Reply
      • Anna

        Jen,

        The Erfa pills I am currently taking expire 03/16. I have 2 grain pills (125 mg), the label is no longer blue/white but pink/white.

        Lola,

        Thank you so much!

        It’s great to have alternatives…I am in Europe (Belgium), and all pharmacies I have been in contact with no longer carry Armour, they only carry Erfa…which means I have no options should I ever find it ineffective even after raising it. I cannot get NP Thyroid or WP Thyroid here, so I am stuck with Erfa…

        Reply
        • Anne

          Anna those sound like the ones I have, batch 13C06 expiry 03/16 125mgs, with a pink and white label. I got mine last November and have been told they were made at the old factory in Belgium but they seem to have some new filler to which I’m allergic, they caused an upset stomach, made me feel faint, dizzy, have palpitations, after three days I went back to an old jar and haven’t taken any more. I’ve heard from four others around the world with bad reactions to that batch and one person who said it was fine. I’ve switched to Thyroid-s and will now try NP or WP.

          Reply
          • Anna

            Anne,

            I looked more closely, and it’s the same batch as yours:-(

    • Jen

      Anna, just wondering – do you have a thyroid?

      Reply
      • Anna

        Yes, I have a thyroid. I was diagnosed with Hashimoto’s thyroiditis in 1995, and spent ten years on T4 drugs only.

        Reply
  197. zai

    Hi everyone,
    First of all thank you for a helpful & insightful forum.
    I have hypothyroidism and been on ERFA for 3 month before travelling to Europe where they only had ARMOUR. I’m back on ERFA now for a month (3 graen) but I’ve had a bad reaction and all my hypo symptoms are back 🙁
    I would like to change to the NP thyroid by Acella but the universal drugstore where I usually get my NDT does not distribute NP thyroid by Acella.

    Does anyone know a pharmacy where I can aquire NP thyroid? Preferably a pharmacy that can send the drug overseas.
    If you prefer you can email me directly at zaimlay@gmail.com
    thanks zai

    Reply
  198. Nick

    I’ve just received a new prescription of ERFA and am disappointed to see that it appears to be the same batch as last time, ie LF0305 02/17.

    I’ve got an appointment with my NHS endo in 10 days time (it’s only taken since May to get it) when I hope to get him to prescribe West Throid instead. What a nightmare!

    Reply
  199. Gore

    If Erfa is not good anymore, what are other options available for Canadians? I checked with several local pharmacies and they all say Erfa is the only NDT they sell. All online pharmacies I found require a prescription from a USA licensed doctor. Looks like switching to NP Thyroid by Acella is the right move, but how do I buy it from Canada?

    Reply
  200. Ken

    Hi! Brand new to using desiccated thyroid. I’ve been on 200 of the synthroid for about 15 years. Complained to my GO to see an endocrinologist and he always said my numbers were in range so there was no need. I had crazy pain between my shoulder blades for years. Given anti inflammatories and codeine lol.
    Anyways I switched GPs and finally got to see an endocrinologist. I asked for desiccated thyroid. I swear the first day…..no cold hands…..and by the end of this week no more muscle aches and my hair coming out has slowed considerably. I also actually feel alert. I’m assuming I’m on Erfa. No idea how to find out the batch number etc….I do feel slightly dizzy and a little bloated but I’m celiac….not sure what’s in the pills. Anyways I feel better than on synthroid but I shouldn’t feel dizzy. Do I lower the desiccated dose a bit or get off it?
    Thanks for the forum! Still learning about desiccated pills!

    Reply
  201. Jen

    Received my new bottle of ERFA today. Expiration Date 4/17 and a completely different label compared to my bottles that expire in 2016.

    Scared to try them..

    Reply
  202. Jen

    Update on ERFA expiration Date: 04/2017
    Lot: LFO 3727A
    125mg.

    About me: Taking ERFA for since 2009 and this is my first try of the “new” batch..or anything after a 2016 expiration date. I normally have a suppressed/optimized TSH but have been going hypo while waiting for the mail and trying to get into a “good” doctor for a new rx of something else.

    Pills are slightly larger.. almost like an M&M in size which is not normal.
    Taste sweeter, like there is definitely more sugar. I wonder if the people saying their heart beat faster were reacting to the sugar? Could be if you have the same reaction to eating candy or some sugared junk food. I know that is a common reaction to people who avoid it out of their diets completely..diabetic or not.

    Pills are softer, pretty much dissolve instantly when you kinda suck on them or just put them under your tongue.
    I’m taking slightly less than my normal dosage because I don’t want to jump into a high dosage right off the bat after being off them…but I’m feeling them kicking in instantly..so they are working. It’s just too soon yet to confirm how well they are working or if they are indeed stronger or weaker than previous batches. I know TSH is useless per STTM, but since I know mine was going up due to NOT being on anything, if my numbers are going back “BELOW RANGE” to what they normally are then for me, personally, it will be a good indication it’s working.

    Reply
    • Jen

      All I’m saying by my post is something is definitely different if they got bigger in size and also scary the company is denying a change. Obviously something changed if the size changed. I still want to try something else…mostly because I’m sick of paying out of pocket for ERFA when Naturethroid and WP can be paid for with my insurance at the local pharmacy once I find a new doctor.

      Reply
      • Anne

        I’ve only just found this latest page, but thanks for coming back about your new tablets and the fact you feel them kicking in as soon as you take them. I’d love to get back to ERFA because I felt good on them originally and because they were just about acceptable to my endo, but I still can’t get hold of any with a 2017 expiry date. I’ve been taking Thyroid-S since June and am now used to them and they’re certainly very much cheaper, but they don’t have a known pharmaceutical company name behind them, so are totally unacceptable to everyone I mention them to here in UK!

        Reply
        • Sandra

          Curious how Thyroid-S is cheaper as I found the opposite?

          Reply
          • Anne

            Hi Sandra, I’m in England which may make a difference. I paid £135 for my last (bad) batch of 500 x 2 grains of ERFA, but I can buy 1000 x 1 grains of Thyroid-S for between £34.99 and £95 depending on which pharmacy I buy from. I can’t get an NHS prescription from my GP here, only a private one from a private doctor, which then has to go through one of our specialist importers and works out more expensive in the end!

        • Jen

          Hi Anne, I actually tried Thyroid-s a few years ago and it made me more hypo than NewArmour. I hate all the colored additives in it, the colors. The taste reminded me of sucking on dry pasta… just colored, processed starch that isn’t good for us.

          The batch of 2017 I bought was from the UK… you can always email them and ask what their current batches are.

          I’m actually on Nature-thyroid right now which I rather not be due to the cellulose. But I’ve had bloodwork done and for me it’s the same as when I was on ERFA. The only reason I switched is because I’m in the USA and if I can at least get a doctor to write me any kind of rx, then my insurance will cover it.

          Reply
  203. Mo

    Erfa update
    125mg
    batch LFO3728A expiry 04/2017
    Have taken for 1 week and better than last batch taken (13c06 expiry 03/2016 -had bad pains in legs when increased dose and gradual decline over the 3 months I took it). Its definitely the newer tablets. Not convinced yet but will see how I go.
    Anyone else on 2017 and doing ok?

    Reply
    • Jen

      Yep, on 2017 as well. I saw at least 2 other people also say they’re on 2017 batches and it’s better. Mine expire 4/17. There is something different about them but now that it’s been a few days, they’re definitely kicking in. I was starting to go hypo from not having anything and I can at least say my energy is better and internal coldness is gone.

      Pains in legs or charlie horses can be from a lack of magnesium so you might want to Google that if all else fails.

      Reply
  204. Ruth

    I dont’ think that the size of the pill necessarily means that what is inside is different. Erfa clearly said that the manufacturer changed so the machines/mold that make pills are maybe different too.Erfa is still working for me and I’m happy to read other good testimonies about it 🙂

    Reply
    • Jen

      Yeah, it’s been a few days on them now and I’m no longer freezing or fatigued so clearly they are working for me even though there is something different about them. I’m still going to get blood work soon just for curiosity to see where the numbers are now since I was feeling like crap being without anything.

      Reply
      • Ruth

        I am so happy for you 🙂
        It’s good to do blood tests. It’s important to know what’s going on in our body (even if numbers often are chinese for us -_- )

        Reply
        • Jen

          Thanks Ruth. I just wanted to update you that I have had bloodwork done after the 2017 ERFA and everything was back to being suppressed. I know TSH doesn’t mean much but I got back down to the 0.0’s where I feel good at.

          Reply
          • Ruth

            This is great 🙂 It’s a good Christmas present! I wish you all the best!

  205. Thea

    Mostly to Ruth: Sorry I didn’t get back to you on this sooner. I’ve been frantically busy.
    I did try to get information about a possible Health Canada recall, but this time they were so tight lipped I got nowhere. I’m about to start on a “new” batch, expiry date May/17; but first I want to get tested to establish a baseline, and I haven’t had the time to do even that. The new pills are a bit blotchy and a shade darker, but the difference is nothing like those pictured on this site. I’ll let everyone know if I start seeing problems with the new batch. Best of luck, everyone!

    Reply
    • Dianne

      Thea, do you mean ERFA was tight-lipped about a possible Health Canada recall, or that Health Canada was tight-lipped? I have a couple of 2017 tabs (LF03831B expiry 05/17). These tabs are smaller than my old stock. My old stock tabs are really white in colour, and matte in appearance. The new 2017 tabs I mentioned have ALOT of brown specks, probably about 40/50% of the tab is speckled. It’s also glossy in appearance. I haven’t tried the 2017 stock; it looks *so* different, I’m anxious about trying them. I wonder what the brownish specks are – cellulose, maybe? I hate speculating (wondering… being fearful), but that’s the position ERFA has left us in, imo.

      Reply
      • Dianne

        I also wonder, if there was a recall in-the-making, you would think that this information would have trickled down to at least some of the pharmacists I’ve spoken to about the ‘ERFA issue’. It’s surprising to me that NONE of the many pharmacists I’ve spoken to, while explaining my problems with the new ERFA, have heard anything about it. I’ll guess that I’ve spoken to approximately 20 pharmacists in my search for old stock. Then again, a couple of them haven’t even heard of ERFA Thyroid.

        Reply
      • Jen

        My 04/2017 Lot: LFO 3727A batch does not have any specks or discoloration to them. That is weird…I wonder if it’s mold from being poorly sealed/stored before it was shipped to you?

        Reply
        • Dianne

          I’m pretty sure the specks aren’t mold. The other two bad batches I had with expiry dates of 2016 also had brown specks. Strange that your 2017 batch has no specks, though.

          Reply
    • Ruth

      Hi Thea 🙂 Thank you for your message. I’m not surprised for Health Canada. Confidential confidential… 😉 I’ve asked the same question to many pharmacists about a recall but they all said “No recall”. 2 pharmacists talked about a short back order but that’s all. Honestly I trusted them. I hope that you will be okay. You’re absolutely right to be tested before taking the pills. It’s the best way to see if they make a difference or not. Best of luck to you and please give us a feedback 🙂

      Reply
      • Thea

        Hi Ruth, Dianne… Sorry for the confusion! My Oct. 27 post was related to earlier ones I made in this thread (Oct. 2&3), in which I said a pharmacist had mentioned a HC recall. When I asked for a copy of their notification or a link to it, though, I got denial that there had ever been a recall – as if the previous conversation had never happened. I have not contacted Erfa or HC; I don’t expect any better luck with that than the numerous others who have tried had.

        Apologies, too, for taking so long to respond. For some reason I can’t get the comments notifications to work – trying something else this time – and I keep forgetting to come back here and look. Will try to check more often! 🙂

        Reply
  206. diane

    omg i had a batch of the 2016 it was sub potent and i can prove it because my t4 was 11 and my t3 was 5.2 i was taking 25mcgs t4 and 1 and 1/4 grains erfa and that was the same blood result as if i was still on 100mcgs t4 when t4 was still good for me, so i ended up on 2 grains of erfa and was getting better (over 6 weeks fine) upset tummy stopped no palpitations, then new batch of of erfa 2017 within 48 hrs palpitations all night, so dropped it, to 50mcg t4 1 grain erfa symptoms came back including upset tummy, so i’m going to try the 25mcgs t4 and 1 and 1/2 grain erfa, i need stability. the pharmacy also gave me 200 pills but 2 different 2017 batches in the same pill bottle, that might be hell.

    Reply
  207. Anna

    I would like to ask if anyone has tried combining Armour with cellulase (Candex etc) to break down cellulose?

    Reply
  208. Mo

    Jen
    how are you doing on the 2017 batch – have been on mine a week and and seem to be going hypo.

    Reply
  209. diane

    i have noticed only discolouration or specks if they have not been kept in a bottle or slightly damp, i have to cut my pills, which is a right pain as they tend to crumble anyway, so check to see if your pills might be being affected by moisture, i keep my pills in the brown bottle they come in, in the fridge because my house temp is 27c as otherwise it is to cold for me. I personally think the new 2017 batches are more potent. i am having to take a grain and a half and 25 mcgs t4 but may put this up to 50 mcgs every 2 days and see how i go, 2 grains of the new efra 2017 batch was to much for me, on the 2016 i’d been on it over 6 weeks and fine. drs have said they must give me pills all from the same batch in future.

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  210. Jenn A

    Here we go again 🙁 I bought a 500 ct 125 mg bottle in Oct of 2013. I ran out a few weeks ago and got more from a different place. The first time I used them I knew it…..they were MUCH softer but tasted the same so I let it go. Fast forward to a week or so ago I start feeling really tired again and start gaining that weight I just lost and it hit me…NOOOOO, NOT AGAIN!!!!! I went through this with Armour and now Erfa,when I was finally feeling good again 🙁
    I was previously taking 3 grains so I bumped it up 4. We’ll see.
    My pills have spots on them and exp in 2017.
    Jenn

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